1. WritingInTheDark

    WritingInTheDark Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2020
    Messages:
    197
    Likes Received:
    53

    What was the best method available to someone living in 1998 to know sunrise and sunset times?

    Discussion in 'Research' started by WritingInTheDark, Nov 6, 2021.

    So, the vampires and werewolves in my setting, along with several others, have an incentive to keep track of exact times for things like sunrise, sunset, civil twilight, and the exact time that a full moon reaches peak fullness. Now, these days I can look up all of that information with ease, down to the very location, with pinpoint accuracy. But in 1998, the internet wasn't as robust as it is today, and I'm not confident that information was as readily available there. What would be the best method my characters have in this time period to look up when these things will happen every day where they live?
     
  2. evild4ve

    evild4ve Critique is stranger than fiction Supporter Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2021
    Messages:
    1,022
    Likes Received:
    1,145
    I've got a feeling they might have been in the small print right at the bottom of the newspaper weather columns, but what about an Almanac from the library?

    And for the US, Old Farmers' Almanac was already online by 1998
    The wayback machine hasn't got the page with the times on it but the link to it can still be seen near the top

    http://web.archive.org/web/19980210030600/http://www.almanac.com/
     
    QueenOfPlants likes this.
  3. Catriona Grace

    Catriona Grace Mind the thorns Contributor Contest Winner 2022

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2021
    Messages:
    6,260
    Likes Received:
    5,511
    Ephemerides.

    Or you could call the state game and fish department.
     
  4. Cress Albane

    Cress Albane Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2021
    Messages:
    161
    Likes Received:
    187
    When I was a kid (early 2000s) my grandma used to buy TV magazines - they always had the exact time of sunrise and sunset written at the top of the page that showed the program for a corresponding day. Poland has always been a few years behind the rest of the world, so I'm guessing the same method could easily apply in 1998's America (or the rest of the world, really).
     
  5. SapereAude

    SapereAude Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    1,714
    Likes Received:
    1,359
    The daily newspaper used to print the time of sunrise and sunset, along with the phase of the moon and the date of the next full moon, I think in the box with the weather forecast. They also included the times for the next high and low tides.

    I have never seen any report that included the exact time of twilight or the exact time (beyond the date) of when the moon would be full.
     
    QueenOfPlants and evild4ve like this.
  6. Bruce Johnson

    Bruce Johnson Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2021
    Messages:
    1,344
    Likes Received:
    960
    How old are these vampires? I'd imagine any centuries old vampire would have gotten the hang of this, maybe not down to the exact minute, but at least within say 10-15 minutes based on the latitude and the time of year, because prior to time zones (which I've heard were created due to trying to standardize train departures and arrivals) everything was local time, right? So if they are living in a northern latitude, they'd known they only have about 9 hours of daylight during the winter, and have a good idea when the sun would rise and set. Of course, if they try and assimilate to our modern culture of time zones, daylight saving time in some regions, etc., that may complicate it, but I imagine they'd learn it pretty quickly.

    Of course for a newer vampire it would be more crucial to rely on some other method like the newspaper, which has already been mentioned. But it's mainly just a function of the latitude and the day of the year (season).
     
    Travalgar and evild4ve like this.
  7. SapereAude

    SapereAude Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2021
    Messages:
    1,714
    Likes Received:
    1,359
    It's also a function of longitude. Latitude affects the length of the day, but longitude affects when it happens. Sunrise and sunset at the eastern edge of the (U.S.) Central time zone are significantly earlier than at the western edge of the Central time zone.
     
  8. NobodySpecial

    NobodySpecial Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2015
    Messages:
    2,079
    Likes Received:
    3,434
    In the US calling 976weather was an easy way. 99 cents per minute to get a comprehensive 24 hour weather report including sunrise and sunset. I’m not sure when they quit running the service, but they were big in the 80s and early to mid 90s.
     
  9. Bruce Johnson

    Bruce Johnson Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2021
    Messages:
    1,344
    Likes Received:
    960
    Yes, in the presence of time zones it would make a significant difference, especially in countries like China which only have one (I think).
     
  10. Xoic

    Xoic Prognosticator of Arcana Ridiculosum Contributor Blogerator

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2019
    Messages:
    12,575
    Likes Received:
    13,641
    Location:
    Way, way out there
    I would imagine if it's important you'd pay attention to exactly when it rises or sets each day and think about how the timing changes gradually. For instance, I know the sun rises roughly around 6:45 am and sets just before 5:00. I'm also aware that as we approach winter the days get shorter and and nights longer. And I remember back in those golden days of summer the sun didn't set until around 8:00 in the evening.

    My own knowledge on this is pretty weak, I don't have the kind of intense interest in it that vampires would. They would doubtless know to the second exactly when it rises and sets on the solstices, and that each day it changes by a few seconds.

    Think about people who rely on the outdoors like farmers, sailors and hunters. They're acutely aware of things like the weather and when the sun rises and sets, and could probably tell you from just a glance at the sky what season it is and what time of day. Vampires would be just as acutely aware of it, though of course from a nighttime perspective.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2021
  11. Cress Albane

    Cress Albane Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2021
    Messages:
    161
    Likes Received:
    187
    Also, if the vampires and werewolves existed for some time in your world, maybe they created their own way of getting the time exactly right? Maybe there is one, specific vampire that keeps track of time so that the rest could function properly?
     
  12. Chromewriter

    Chromewriter Contributor Contributor

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2021
    Messages:
    728
    Likes Received:
    521
    Location:
    Australia
    This is a very odd question. Maybe to the point where I'd say most readers probably wouldn't care for an explanation. If you have a vampire character who is acutely aware of the time of sunrise and sundown, I wouldn't care how they would know.

    But if you really want to get into the details of it, just to be fun, how about the moon moving fluids (like a tide) around in their brain which they are sensitive enough to use as an accurate internal clock.
     
    Cress Albane likes this.
  13. Xoic

    Xoic Prognosticator of Arcana Ridiculosum Contributor Blogerator

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2019
    Messages:
    12,575
    Likes Received:
    13,641
    Location:
    Way, way out there
    Actually I would think they'd have a powerful internal reaction, like a 'quickening' that happens as the sun is setting—waking them if they're sleeping—and letting them know it's time to seek shelter when that awful repulsive orb begins to peek over the horizon.
     
    evild4ve likes this.
  14. Bruce Johnson

    Bruce Johnson Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2021
    Messages:
    1,344
    Likes Received:
    960
    Daylight! No!
    Please, no!
     
    Xoic likes this.
  15. J.T. Woody

    J.T. Woody Book Witch Contributor

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2018
    Messages:
    4,158
    Likes Received:
    8,703
    The wonderful, magical Library

    [​IMG]

    (internet might not have been robust, but the card catalogue was)
     
    Travalgar, Xoic and evild4ve like this.
  16. TStarnes

    TStarnes New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2021
    Messages:
    12
    Likes Received:
    15
    Having been alive and an active internet user in 1998, I'd like to point out the information was easily and readily available. Open up Netscape, do a Yahoo search, and boom, answer.
     
    Steerpike, Cress Albane and evild4ve like this.
  17. Bruce Johnson

    Bruce Johnson Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2021
    Messages:
    1,344
    Likes Received:
    960
    But wouldn't you have to search based on your location? And if it were obscure, it might take a little more work than today's search engine (Google). I don't know if the weather widgets existed back then or if location based cookies were common either. I'm just wondering how effective the search engines in 1998 would be in giving a quick answer at the top of the page. I think my preference was Webcrawler at that time.
     
  18. evild4ve

    evild4ve Critique is stranger than fiction Supporter Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2021
    Messages:
    1,022
    Likes Received:
    1,145
    As well as www.almanac.com there seems to have been www.worldtime.com. The wayback machine's snapshot for 1998 is broken but by February 1999 it was offering " For a selection of presently about 550 cities and towns, the current local time as well as the sunrise and sunset times for the current day are given." If anything it used to be easier to find stuff before everyone started gaming the search results
     
  19. TStarnes

    TStarnes New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2021
    Messages:
    12
    Likes Received:
    15
    They were effective enough. I could have found updated sunrise/sunset for my location in a few mintues search. Search wasn't as good as google now, but it wasn't that much worse either. There might be a step or 2 extra to get information for your precise location, but it was doable (this doesn't count the walled garden internet that still exhisted like AOL and Prodigy which had front pages with your location and info like this or news sites like Yahoo news and the like where you could find this as well).

    There isn't a doubt in my mind I could have found this info a couple of minutes tops, if the location was within any kind of distance of a major city, and maybe under five minutes for more out of the way areas.

    For reference:

    https://web.archive.org/web/19981212033446/https://www.timeanddate.com/
    https://web.archive.org/web/20000302005419/https://www.sunrisesunset.com/
     
    Bruce Johnson and evild4ve like this.
  20. newjerseyrunner

    newjerseyrunner Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2022

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2016
    Messages:
    1,462
    Likes Received:
    1,432
    Newspaper or radio. Both still exist today, just less used. Newspapers always have a small corner dedicated to weather, and it includes sunrise and sunset. Most radio stations also have an hourly weather report (for some reason it's usually 8 minutes past the hour here.)

    Also, the precision of the sun's position is calculable to anyone who really wants to know for anyone with a high school level of mathematics.
     
    evild4ve likes this.
  21. Naomasa298

    Naomasa298 HP: 10/190 Status: Confused Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2019
    Messages:
    5,356
    Likes Received:
    6,179
    Location:
    The White Rose county, UK
    In the UK, I believe you could just call the Met Office to get that information.

    Also, as @newjerseyrunner suggests above, I imagine centuries-old vampires would have had plenty of time to study the astronomy required to calculate sunrise and sunset.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice