1. Shadow Dragon
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    Shadow Dragon Contributing Member Contributor

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    Democracy

    Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Shadow Dragon, Aug 31, 2008.

    I figured that Democracy would be a good topic of discussion, with the presidential election going on (atleast for those of us that live in the U.S.).

    Personaly, I have become really jaded with the democratic process. I think it can only be successful if the people act as constant government watchdogs, but it seems like they couldn't care less about their elected leaders most of the time. I always hear people complaining about the government, but yet they seem to elect the same group of people back into power. Also, the masses seem to be able to get conned easily at times. All a politician has to do is give a good speech and look like they are an average joe; the people will elect them. And it doesn't hurt to say that you have a connection to god, for getting votes in rural areas. It seems to take forever to get things done, because the leaders are more worried about their image than anything else, and they won't even touch something that is controversial doing an election season. The people never look at voting records and never seem to double check what the leaders say in speeches. Hell, all that seems to matter most of the time is what party the person is in. (Disclaimer: I can't say this about all democracies, its just what I have observed here in the U.S.)

    At this point, as long as there was a constitution that said what the government was and wasn't allowed to do (and it was actually followed), I would be fine with having a monarch or emperor in charge. Atleast they wouldn't have to pander to the masses and special interest groups all the time.

    So, what do you guys think about democracy? I ask that people respond in a civil manner to each other in this thread, so it doesn't get locked. Thank you.
     
  2. Banzai
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    Banzai One-time Mod, but on the road to recovery Contributor

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    Democracy doesn't work. It's just the best we have so far, and people have interpreted that as meaning it is perfect. Communism made the fatal flaw of assuming that people were fundamentally decent and could put the good of the whole before that of the individual (which they aren't). Democracy makes a worse assumption. It assumes that people are intelligent and attentive enough to be able to choose their leaders. They aren't. That has been demonstrated time and again.

    I don't have a better suggestion, I just wish people would stop looking to democracy as a solution to all problems. It's anything but.
     
  3. lordofhats
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    lordofhats Contributing Member

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    You're absolutely right. That is the fatal flaw of the democratic system. If the people aren't active the system fails or rather in the US's case, flounders. The problem also isn't help by a horribly politically biased mass media (With the exception of Fox News, its pretty much pure Liberal) and the horrible apathy of voters. It never ceases to stupify me how people think not voting will help the system XD.

    It is however something that can't be helped. The Democratic system has its flaws as much as any other but I prefer it to alternatives that are avaliable. The system is what it is and you can demonize it or accept it. Frankly all we really need to make the system work is to improve political awareness (No real answers as far as how to achieve that from me though XD).

    Here in lies the problem. You create a constitution to tell Person A what they can and can't do. Person A is the only political authority as an Emperor/King/Queen. Now Person A has all political power and there's really no point in obeying said constitution when there's nothing to stop him/her from doing whatever they want.
     
  4. ciavyn
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    ciavyn Senior Member

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    As you pointed out, Shadow Dragon - democracy is only a success if the people remain vigilant. In our case in the U.S., we have a republic, which requires the same tenacity and focus. But we have become lazy people, who are willing to accept handouts, expect miracles, and will do nothing to make a change. Read Animal Farm again - is that the system of government that we want? Most of us don't. But are we willing to stand up and fight, like our founding fathers, for the system of government we believe in? Unfortunately, I think our answer is staring us in our couches.
     
  5. Eoz Eanj
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    Eoz Eanj Contributing Member Contributor

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    I know next to nothing about politics and I'm extremely apathetic to the subject, in fact I haven't even enrolled yet to vote in Australia's state election

    All I know is that the world is going to Hell

    so political party or leaning doesn't even seem to matter anymore

    Haha

    I'm so optimistic at 3.45am
     
  6. lordofhats
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    lordofhats Contributing Member

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    I think there was a recent book on this subject about the Gridlock of the US political system. It was on the Colbert Report last week I think. I'm trying to find the title and author.

    The book is about how now most politicians by the time they've been elected, rather than fulfilling election promises, choose to instead start planning for reelection. People might call me crazy but I commend Bush in that respect. Rather than thinking only of being reelected he decided to do what he thought was best for the country. Was he wrong? We'll time will tell us. I wonder what the history books will say in forty years (Hopefully I'll still be alive to read them XD).
     
  7. Aurora_Black
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    Aurora_Black Contributing Member

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    According to the Mayan Calender the world ends on 2012.

    I hope old-age does the trick instead though.
     
  8. lordofhats
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    lordofhats Contributing Member

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    An excellent point. If the world ended in 2012... well that would just suck :(. Old age for everyone :D!
     
  9. Nilfiry
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    Nilfiry Contributing Member

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    IMHO, Politics is the second most corrupted.
     
  10. Banzai
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    Banzai One-time Mod, but on the road to recovery Contributor

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    Second most corrupted...what? :confused:
     
  11. kehl
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    kehl Member

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    I believe that a more "Republic" style government would work...except that, just like people, politicians are(or can be) corrupt. It seems like "people" are the stick in the spokes of every government; communism, socialism, democracy, republics. The set up is perfect, but the people are not. I don't think that it's ever going to change.

    As far as my ideal government: I think it's different depending on size, mindset, values, culture etc...If I could model my personal government after a country it would be Canada. Moderatly socialistic, but also capitalist, and democratic.

    What we lack here is respect for our neighbors- While looking out for one's self is natural, the way we do it is harmful.
     
  12. Acglaphotis
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    Acglaphotis Contributing Member

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    Universe Today's article about that. I suggest you read it, it gives a lot of insight about why the mayans didn't predict the world would end that day ( with sources ).

    PS: That remimded me of a friend who had the habit of reminding everyone the world would end on 2012, haha.
     
  13. TWErvin2
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    TWErvin2 Contributing Member Contributor

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    Part of the problem with voting in the USA is that local politics has less power than originally intended by the framers.

    The federal government was not meant to be all controlling. But through a small loophole and liberally ruled upon, I speak of the interstate commerce clause in the constitution, the federal government granted itself licence to get into just about every aspect of our lives.

    I believe that it is easier to hold town, county, city and even state politicians accountable, as opposed to federal representatives. But now, they have less impact as they are harnessed (or can simply point to) federal rules, laws, regulations, whatever.

    In their consitutions, many state governments must have a balanced budget. It's tough sometimes during lean years, but many wise state governments establish 'rainy day' funds.

    If, for example, I am not happy about what's going on in my town, I can walk down to the local cafe and talk to the mayor, who owns and runs it. Some of the city councilmen/women, attend my church. Even our state representative comes to town on occasion. I'm not one of the faceless mass, and they're not the distant, inaccessible politician.

    Terry
     
  14. Nilfiry
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    Nilfiry Contributing Member

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    Are you saying "What?" to second most corrupted or just corrupted?
     
  15. lordofhats
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    lordofhats Contributing Member

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    I think he wants to know what politics is the second most corrupted of.
     
  16. Aurora_Black
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    Aurora_Black Contributing Member

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    That was a really cool read haha! Thanks for posting that up, i'm not much of the "Doomsday" person, like when the movie "The Omen" came out 6/6/06 people thought the devil would raise the dead or something which was hilarious. But like most others, this superstition failed.
     
  17. NaCl
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    NaCl Contributing Member Contributor

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    Democracy ONLY works if our representatives are held accountable. At a local level, democracy still works, but the massive federal government that evolved through Franklin Roosevelt's "New Deal" shifted power away from the states, creating a bloated new federal government that manipulates voters, rather than listening to them. Democracy, as intended by our forefathers, died in 1933.

    I wish I knew how to bring it back!
     
  18. Aurora_Black
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    Aurora_Black Contributing Member

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    A rebellion led by Mel Gibson!!
     

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