1. bustead
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    bustead Member

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    International reactions to the portal

    Discussion in 'Research' started by bustead, Aug 27, 2015.

    In my novel, a fantasy army emerged from a portal and tried to invade our world, only to be defeated by Earth's powerful military. 2 days after reclaiming Sydney (ground zero of the invasion), the 5 permanent security council member states (China, Russia, US, France, Britain) announced that they will, in the name of UN, form an expeditionary force and invade the fantasy world in the name of revenge without consulting other nations. (full plot idea: http://www.writingforums.org/threads/nebie-needs-help.140764/)


    How will other countries react to this incident? How will NGOs (Non Government Organizations) react to the security council's decision? What about media and the public? What will your own reaction be?

    PS: I have got some ideas for certain countries (eg Australia will most likely join the expeditionary force in the name of vengeance , Israel may want the US to focus on the security issues in the Middle-East instead) but it is always good to listen to your constructive opinion (and criticism) so feel free to leave your thoughts below.
     
  2. Shadowfax
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    Shadowfax Contributing Member Contributor

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    Hi Bustead,

    Having seen reactions to recent (last 20 years) events in the middle East, I don't believe you'd get all three of China, Russia and the US singing from the same hymn sheet. UK would probably go along with the US (special relationship, do'ncha know) and France would please itself.

    To be honest, I'd research the Gulf War for who sided with whom, and which NGOs supported and which were against.

    Media and the public? Mixed, depending on what was better for their bottom line, or whether they had a moral viewpoint.

    Remember, Hitler was convinced that the USA would never enter the war against Germany "They will never pick up a rifle if it means putting down a cash register." and he may have been right...it was Germany who declared war against the USA, in support of its ally Japan.
     
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  3. bustead
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    bustead Member

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    Actually, they are not singing from the same hymn sheet. US wants to control oil fields in the fantasy world while Russia wanted to maintain control over gas and oil prices on Earth by sabotaging the American operations. China wants a new export market and more living space while France and Britain wanted to colonize the entire fantasy world. This is not unlike WW2, where US and UK allied with USSR because they have a common enemy (in my story it is the fantasy army instead of the Nazis) even though they hate each other. You can read my plot for details :D
     
  4. Wreybies
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    Wreybies The Ops Pops Operations Manager Staff Contest Administrator Supporter Contributor

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    If you're looking for real-world based opinion, how about the reaction to the intrusion of this other/parallel/fantasy/demonic world into our world. As an American I fully expect the more committed Religious Right in my country to go completely ape-shit in a bewildering array of directions ranging from "nuke them sons'a'bitches" to "the Second Coming is upon us". Now, if you're looking for more comic book style reaction where human nature is often completely eschewed in deference to wanting to include certain plot elements, then, one must take into account, at the very least, the current relationship the countries you mention have with Australia. The U.S. and the U.K., yes, I can see these two players come to the rescue of Oz, but China and Russia?
     
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  5. BrianIff
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    BrianIff I'm so piano, a bad punctuator. Contributor

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    Realistically, I don't see the UN going to war for revenge, but that depends on the tone of your novel, and whether it's presented as "real world."

    Also, England and France don't have the strength to colonize anymore. Would you be making a statement about their nature? I say that as a caution.
     
  6. Wreybies
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    Wreybies The Ops Pops Operations Manager Staff Contest Administrator Supporter Contributor

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    Agreed. The Age of Exploration is long past. The big players of that time (England, France, Portugal, Spain, and Holland) simply aren't players of that level anymore. If anything, were there to be countries in this story that seek colonization as a goal, I would look toward Asia. This would be a more compelling reason for China to be involved (IMO), and leaving Korea out of this game is a big real-world miss.
     
  7. BrianIff
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    BrianIff I'm so piano, a bad punctuator. Contributor

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    What do you see with them?
     
  8. Wreybies
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    Wreybies The Ops Pops Operations Manager Staff Contest Administrator Supporter Contributor

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    Economic clout, technical capacity, and physical proximity that may be concerning to them.
     
  9. BrianIff
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    BrianIff I'm so piano, a bad punctuator. Contributor

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    Oh, I thought you were talking about Kim. He'd probably soil himself if we were invaded. Then tell him to give up his stockpile for protection.
     
  10. Wreybies
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    Wreybies The Ops Pops Operations Manager Staff Contest Administrator Supporter Contributor

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    LOL :) No, no. South Korea. ;)
     
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  11. bustead
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    bustead Member

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    A Chinese satellite went down in the south pacific before the portal opened so a small surface fleet was trying to locate the downed satellite while investigating the odd weather near the crash site. When the the fantasy army attacked Chinese embassy in Sydney, the Chinese fleet abandoned their mission and (under US and Australian navies' close "escort") headed towards Sydney to evacuate Chinese citizens trapped there. The destruction of the Chinese embassy gave the perfect excuse for China to step into the war later. However the Australian government was angered by the Chinese operation so they didn't let the Chinese army to operate in Australian soil (unlike US, Britain and France), causing logistical problems for the PLA in the other world (as the portal was still in Sydney).

    Russia didn't really join the war in Sydney. However when Russian spies reported that the fantasy world was habitable (stolen info from CIA), the Russian government feared that resources held in their hands (oil and gas) would become worthless when the supply of them skyrockets so in the secret meeting of the "big 5", Russia insist that they should "act as a responsible nation" and "protect Earth from further aggression by direct military actions". They agreed to retreat from Ukraine (the Russian army was closing into Kiev in the novel) and supply Chinese troops should it be necessary. So they got to join the force.
     
  12. bustead
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    UK and France didn't really try to colonize the entire fantasy world. They spend time in sparking racial aggression among different races in the other world and take advantage of it by selling weapons to both sides of the same conflict. Then they can also take part of the loser's land whenever they see fit. France is more inclined towards weapon and technology sales while Britain is more interested in expansion. (PS: French weapons sales and the Falklands War gave me the idea)

    Oh yes. Korea was to join the conflict. However I am concerned about the possible role of S. Korea in the story. What do they want in this? Oil? Land? Food? I was trying to make every nation in the novel to act on their own interests so I need a reason for Korea to join the war.
    PS: They also have to find a way to convince the Americans to let them join the war since in theory ROK army is still under US command.
     
  13. plothog
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    plothog Contributing Member Supporter Contributor

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    Unless the world has changed a lot, I can't imagine many countries would protest if the case was compelling enough to get all those five countries to work together. Except for a handful of oddball states, such as North Korea, pretty much the whole world tends to find it diplomatically prudent to go along with something agreed by all 5 permanent members of the security council.
    A lot of countries might not send forces, or might send a minimal amount just to show willing, but I can't imagine many daring to speak out against the action.

    I'm not sure why the security council would feel the need to make their deal secretly.

    Could very well be civilian groups who oppose the action, but I'd be surprised if their demonstrations amounted to much consequence.

    I'd except most of the human vs human tension of consequence to be between the uneasy allies.
     
  14. bustead
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    UN didn't declare war, the "big 5" do it themselves in the name of UN so UN is a mere tool for them to rationalize the invasion. The real question is will other member states tag along and attack the fantasy world? Or will they be angered by the powers' actions?
     
  15. bustead
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    1. The 5 powers were trying to take the entire fantasy world and divide it among themselves. They don't want other powers (like India) to take part in the war and take their slice of the cake.
    2. Some countries maybe allowed to join and send a small expeditionary force alongside with the main force. However it is not likely for these small units to do much anyway.
    3. Uneasy allies will be an understatement. Russia is to bomb American positions with bombers in the novel. China is to secretly gather evidence of Britain's actions and use it for propaganda in the other world. The powers' struggle is (hopefully) one of the major points of the book!
     
  16. BrianIff
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    BrianIff I'm so piano, a bad punctuator. Contributor

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    I know that China is increasing trade with Brazil and much of Africa, so China could tell them to send soldiers because of the investment China provides. US could probably twist the arm of Latin America. England and France don't have much to offer to another country for military might, which makes me think that a U.S.-China-led coalition would be more appropriate, or add the EU, if you want countries to join. How do you see it playing out? Do you have a lot countries contributing, or?

    I can't see them being angry, especially if we're not dealing with a human world. Obviously some would warn of the unknown.
     
  17. matwoolf
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    matwoolf Contributing Member Contributor

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    Hoy Brian,

    I wrote one of these 'fantasy' invasion stories. I'll dig it out, and make it available to you through our channels. You can copy, I don't mind. TWAT, sound like twat
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2015
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  18. BrianIff
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    BrianIff I'm so piano, a bad punctuator. Contributor

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    *turns red* Promise you won't tell gran'ma about what I said, gran'pa? I still have bird-watching in Paris to look forward to..."

    Plot Twist: Uncle Sam gets custody ;)
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2015
  19. A.M.P.
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    A.M.P. People Buy My Books for the Bio Photo Supporter Contributor

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    This sounds exactly, word for word, country for country, like the anime Gate...
     
  20. bustead
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    bustead Member

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    I do see lots of countries joining but it will be hard for you to write about them all. I was thinking about combining certain forces as a whole in battle. For example instead of writing about the German army directly, I can write about the German-lead EU Battlegroup instead.
     
  21. plothog
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    plothog Contributing Member Supporter Contributor

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    It seems like the question has shifted from who wants to tag along, to who would be allowed to tag along.

    If India said this is a UN action, we'll join in too, what would stop them? Maybe they could get a resolution passed to limit the invading force to specific countries. (Not sure what argument they'd use for this)

    To get a UN resolution passed you need to get nine votes from the security council. So they'd need to get 4 of the 10 non-permanent members onside too.
    If they don't manage this it seems to me that the argument that it's all in the name of the UN falls apart at some point.

    Maybe Australia would only let certain forces on their land to get to the portal. I'm struggling to fit this all together in my head now though.
     
  22. bustead
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    bustead Member

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    I have asked about that in another thread. I didn't even know that thing exist before I wrote a chapter or so since I hate amine. After checking Gate (comics version) out I was disgusted by its right-wing ideology and sexism so I have decided to keep writing my novel. See the original thread: http://www.writingforums.org/threads/i-am-losing-motivation.140955/
     
  23. bustead
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    In UN, permanent security council members nearly always get their resolutions passed even though the mechanism you mentioned exist. Usually a non-permanent security council member will get some Economic aid from the US and/or other 4 powers. (Check the video at the end) In this case, the 5 powers are going to draft a resolution that works the best for them and other countries may not be able to interfere. The security council can simply say that each continent/zone is given a certain quota of troops that they can fill. However the P-5 powers all get independent quota and rules of engagement.

    On the other hand, Australia is to stop certain forces from operating in their soil. As I have said they refused to let the Chinese and the Russians to establish a base in Australia, causing logistical problems for both nations. The ADF (Australian army) will form Military Police units that is authorized to arrest/trial any soldier from any military force if they break any Australian laws (which will obviously cause diplomatic problems when Russian troops decided to drive their tanks while drunk!)

    )
     

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