1. jazzabel
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    jazzabel Contributing Member Contributor

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    Interview with John Perkins

    Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by jazzabel, Oct 19, 2013.

    I wanted to share this interesting interview with John Perkins, which offers some insights into inner workings of NSA and US government's rise to superpower. There's too much in this interview to offer an useful summary, but a lot of what we've been talking about on the forum lately, is discussed from first hand perspective of the former operative.

     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2013
  2. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    It's an interesting story in which Mr. Perkins loves to pander to the anti-establishment crowd. He makes a small fortune off of people who love conspiracy theories about 9/11, political assassinations. etc... Most of his claims come with little or no evidence and a good chunk of his claims have been thoroughly debunked.

    I'm never one to take anything someone is trying to sell me at face value.

    At one of his events he suggested that Nike could give shoes to all the poor people in the world and McDonalds could end world hunger, but when asked if he would give out his books for free or reduce its ridiculous $25 price, he said, "That's up to my publisher." He has built his life upon lying to people and there's no reason to take him seriously now.
     
  3. jazzabel
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    jazzabel Contributing Member Contributor

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    Hehe, my friend, we meet again :) Thank you for your input, you might be right. I find it perfectly plausible, with the understanding that he can't really reveal anything too damaging to his employers, or he would suffer the consequences. 30 years have passed, and that is the initial secrecy limit (*at least it is for SAS) but I'm sure there's lots more he isn't saying. In any case, I found it interesting, I'm glad you did too.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2013
  4. GingerCoffee
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    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    I've read his book, "Confessions of an Economic Hit Man". Having spent some time in Central America and the Caribbean when the US was supporting dictators like Somoza in Nicaragua and the 14 Families in El Salvador, his claims were consistent with what I saw first hand. However, some of the criticisms pointed out in the Wiki entry on the book have validity as well. Not everything Perkins says is supported by the evidence. But a lot of it is, and Perkins responded to the criticism with additional evidence supporting his claims.

    As for the price of his book, I'm pretty sure publishers not authors indeed set new book prices. I don't think world corporations with billions in profits not giving back enough to the communities they operate in is equivalent to one person not donating his/her income to the same cause.
     
  5. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    Well, we will have to agree to disagree. Looking over this mans life it becomes apparent that he is more of an opportunist than anything. It seems his allegiances lie with whatever cause is most profitable at the time. Kind of like a pirate, allying himself with whatever way the wind blows.

    I do find it amusing when a conspiracy theorist gets refuted by multiple first-hand accounts, because it enamors their fans into saying, 'That's exactly what someone covering up something would say!'

    I'm sure he's making buckets of money though, so yay for the capitalism that he preaches against.
     
  6. erebh
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    erebh Contributing Member Contributor

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    If I were him I wouldn't be getting on any private planes any time soon...

    @JJ_Maxx How do you know where or how he lives? People say the same about david Icke making vast fortunes off his bullshit - he has a tiny house where @jazzabel wants to live on the Isle of Wight.
     
  7. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    Oh, making money off of bullshit is as American as baseball and I support it 100%. (Al Gore for example.)

    But, the difference lies when you make money from telling people that making money is wrong. Then, in my opinion, you jut become a sleazeball.
     
  8. erebh
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    erebh Contributing Member Contributor

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    which he admits in the interview, but his recent 'confessions' are borne from guilt. I bet if he showed 'evidence' he's have to share a flat with Snowden in the USSR ;)
     
  9. erebh
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    erebh Contributing Member Contributor

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    I haven't heard of this guy till this video. In it, he doesn't say making money is evil - he says the US Govt paying him and his like (economic hitmen) are wrong. He freely admits he made a fortune from conning poor countries on behalf Reagan etc and it hit him one day while sailing on his 40 foot yacht in the Virgin Islands how guilty he was. If you don't want to watch the video you can fast forward to 24 minutes.

    Wow did I just say fast forward? How 80s Sony Walkman am I? lol!
     
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  10. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    I agree, you could believe him or not. There's evidence to support both sides.

    I just think it's reasonable to believe that he is pandering to a certain audience in an effort to make money. Any higher purpose to his dogma is not evident. In my opinion, people who honestly believe that the US Government is capable of assassinating people that speak against them, have their own anti-establishment bias backing that up.

    It is a fact that there is a niche of consumers who dislike America enough that they will swallow any and all theories that paint the country in a bad light. It's just a fact of life. They will always exist.
     
  11. jazzabel
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    jazzabel Contributing Member Contributor

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    @JJ_Maxx: Look, I respect your opinion, even though I could not disagree more with you on most issues, but I was hoping to post this video as something interesting for people to discuss. Not for you to monopolise the discussion again with your political views which are really well known by now. You said what you think, several times, if you don't like it, please move on. Why keep hanging around and repeating how this is untrue or crap and what not?
     
  12. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    Sorry, it just doesn't work that way. I know you think this video is interesting and probably supports your viewpoints, but you have to understand that this is a discussion forum populated by people with a variety of perspectives.

    I have the right to share my viewpoints just as much as you have the right to disagree with me.

    But we don't have the right to silence opposing viewpoints. ;)
     
  13. GingerCoffee
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    Here's the transcript for people that don't have 44 minutes to listen to the interview.

    The interview took place in 2007, near the end of the Bush era. Bush, based on the Cheney-Rumsfeld vision, set out to privatize a large section of the military. It was and still is a very disturbing trend. Few people paid attention to private security contractors that were immune from prosecution in Iraq, some of whom were hired to police New Orleans in the aftermath of Katrina.
    While preventing looting is certainly desirable, it's questionable it's worth having unaccountable private armies running around the city to do it.

    Jeremy Scahill has written an extensive account of the use of Blackwater, which has acted outside normal military oversight all over the world. The exposé resulted in bad publicity for Blackwater's founder, the Evangelical Bush crony, Erik Prince. So the company changed its name and leadership, with Prince taking a less visible role.

    The discussion about the pollution in the rain forest in Ecuador, and the possible assassination of two men who wouldn't play ball, again is consistent with the history in that country. When I was there a few years ago there was a travel advisory for Americans not to go to the rain forest because of the unrest in that part of the country.

    Just recently Chevron switched to another tactic after losing (so far) the lawsuit Ecuador brought against them to clean up the pollution their operations caused.

    Chevron Launches RICO Trial Over $18 Billion Ecuador Verdict Tuesday
    Gawd knows what kind of corruption that is going to involve. Chevron lost the lawsuit with Ecuador, including the last appeal, so I guess the company is going after the assessment of the damages being fraudulently calculated.

    Anyway, if Perkins made everything up, he certainly did extensive research to base it on. I doubt he made it all up. Certainly not everyone looking at the same facts, sees the same thing. So Perkins has a particular POV. I wish more people knew about those facts regardless of how they view them.
     
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  14. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    Another thread with a beating political heart, another debate that will (and really already has) descended into squabbles. Guys, this is boring now.
     
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  15. GingerCoffee
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    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    I do so hope you aren't counting my post in that charge. :(

    Regardless, I wasn't planning on saying much more on the subject anyway.
     
  16. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    Oh no, please don't think that. You were not directly addressing any of the other posts afterall.
     
  17. JJ_Maxx
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    JJ_Maxx Banned

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    I hope you didn't count me in that either. In fact, besides one issue that has since been resolved, the discussion has been quite pleasant.
     
  18. jazzabel
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    jazzabel Contributing Member Contributor

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    Yeah, I agree, it's really boring listening to the same rants over and over again. Do we have to? On the second thought, I'll unwatch my own thread, because that'd be the best solution [​IMG]
     
  19. erebh
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    erebh Contributing Member Contributor

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    I didn't notice any comments that warranted a whisper to the higher-ups either
     

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