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  1. Keith Trimm
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    Keith Trimm Banned

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    The book section at K Mart

    Discussion in 'Publishing' started by Keith Trimm, Jan 6, 2013.

    Last night I had an hour to kill before going to the Hobbit movie so me and the wife stopped at K Mart to waste some time. I eventually found the book section and browsed what they had and came to the same realization that I made 20 years ago that there is only room for 3 at the top and they aren't letting go for anybody.

    I recognized many of the authors names, and saw how few "new" authors were displayed anywhere. It's like that in the music industry as well, only there is no stigma against recording your own cd, it's actually looked upon as a good thing as opposed to those here who think self publishing is like a festering pimple on the untouchable reputation of the main stream publishing industry.

    If artists are going to break out, they have to make their own breaks, not wait for some agent to do it for them. personally do not care for the "purists" who can't break away from the industry mold of the past. I have 2 books self published and available on a well known national web sales site. I don't have to beg for room on the limited shelves at K Mart. K Mart doesn't dictate my art or how I market my art.

    Self publishing is the way of the future, embrace it or dig your own grave.
     
  2. thirdwind
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    thirdwind Contributing Member Contest Administrator Reviewer Contributor

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    The book section at Kmart does not accurately represent the publishing industry or its trends. I'm not even sure the average reader buys books in places like that. Go to a proper bookstore and look for new writers there (my local B&N has a display table dedicated to debut novels). You'll find plenty of them.
     
  3. shadowwalker
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    shadowwalker Contributing Member Contributor

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    Yeah, kinda like looking for a Porterhouse at a hamburger stand and deciding the butcher got it wrong.
     
  4. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    I assume a K-Mart is a superstore, like ASDA or Sainsbury's?

    Going to a superstore to check out the books is a bit like going to a farmers' market and getting angry about the lack of drinks on sale - what do you expect? You are in the wrong place! If you want a book then go to a book shop. It's kind of why book shops exist.
     
  5. chicagoliz
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    chicagoliz Contributing Member Contributor

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    K-Mart is actually a down-market superstore. It's been around for a long time, barely surviving and well behind its main competitors, Wal-Mart and Target, with which you might be familiar. It's not a place most people would go to buy books. This OP has started many threads to say the same thing, which is his disdain for traditional publishing.
     
  6. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    I see. Thanks. :) Learn something every day. As for the thread, I just can't take it seriously. There is a saying a family friend has: 'You don't buy Shakespeare with a bag of prawns'.
     
  7. Keith Trimm
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    Keith Trimm Banned

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    Yes, I start many threads, I am a writer. I have an opinion, and from what you have replied I seem to have struck a nerve. There are far more Wal-Marts, K Marts, Targets, and other super stores out there than Barnes and Knoble's. Your average shopper shops at these stores, not the ones who cater to the "elite" class of super consumers who prefer their books served next to a coffee shop.

    Trash me if you will, but the net evens the playing field for everyone, which is a good thing. One day we can all drive our horse and buggy down to the "book" store and see what the establishment has dictated is good enough for us to read. Until then, I'll keep my eyes open for what I really want.
     
  8. mammamaia
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    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    ditto to all of the responses... it's simply not a valid argument...

    and that's not a logical contrast between self-publishing books and making one's own music cd, since published songwriters and music publishers certainly don't view amateurs' cds and their creators as being equal in status to published songs/songwriters, any more than do literary critics, paying publishers and 'published authors' in re books put out by any of the many varieties of vanity publishing and their authors...

    the difference between self-made music cds and self-published books lies only in their chances of their creators reaching the professional level, since a music demo cd can be sent to artists and others who can give the songwriter a decent chance at being published, which isn't really doable with a self-published book...
     
  9. Keith Trimm
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    Keith Trimm Banned

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    I guess the issue lies in the term "status" Just because a corporation puts out a cd doesn't make the song writing or production any better or any worse than one done at home or in a paid studio. Don't let the CEO's dictate what is art and what is crap. They have limited budgets to promote so only a few get in. I've heard plenty of local touring bands that rival what the "pro's" create.

    With your attitude, no one would ever strive to become better, we are all amateur and not worthy of Mr. Big money and his blessings. Get off your elitist pedestal and realize that art has nothing to do with money, art has to do with art.
     
  10. Knarfia
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    Knarfia Member

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  11. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    Serious question: What are you going on about? Since when was book shops 'the establishment'? I didn't realize that having more choice of what to buy, in the area you are wanting to buy, means less choice ... that's literally nonsense.

    Also, FYI: we are not criticizing you because we are 'elitists' we are criticizing because what you are saying doesn't hold weight. If you can't accept that then I can see why you have problems with critics in general.
     
  12. Keith Trimm
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    Keith Trimm Banned

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    Just out of curiosity, how many of you fine folks here have ever been accepted and published by anybody? Please send me a link to your non self published book in a pm so I can take a look, thanks.
     
  13. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    I've worked as a journalist and published in newspapers and literary magazines from across the UK. If you want to read my stuff you'll have to come to the UK and folk out some cash.
     
  14. TWErvin2
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    TWErvin2 Contributing Member Contributor

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    One can follow the link in my signature below to my blog, which has a link to my website and information on my 'non self published' novels.' There one can also find where many of my short stories were published before being released in a collection of short stories by my publisher.

    As an aside, I sometimes find it interesting to observe the animosity between self published and traditionally published writers, or those aspiring in one direction or the other.
     
  15. BritInFrance
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    BritInFrance Active Member

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    This whole argument is pointless.

    Keith has already stated that he gives his ebooks away for free. Supermarkets and bookshops do not (and the authors get paid).

    So, as there is no comparison to be made, there is no valid point in his original post.
     
  16. Keith Trimm
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    Keith Trimm Banned

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    I have paper backs at lulu.com for sale. Sorry, didn't mention that. Thanks for calling me pointless, made my day.
     
  17. Lemex
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    Lemex That's Lord Lemex to you. Contributor

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    He didn't. Read his post again.
     
  18. thirdwind
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    thirdwind Contributing Member Contest Administrator Reviewer Contributor

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    Sure, the average shopper may shop at those stores, but he/she isn't shopping for books. The selection of books at Kmart, etc. is very limited compared to real bookstores. You really should visit a used bookstore. None of the people who go there are in the "elite class of super consumers."
     
  19. peachalulu
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    peachalulu Contributing Member Reviewer Contributor

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    K-mart, Walmart etc. represents more the averageness of people than trends in publishing. You're
    not shopping there to delight in your individuality - but to pick up generic items. So if you're
    a weekend reader interested in entertainment why not pick up Kellerman, King or Meyer at half price?
    Especially, if you've never heard of Karen Russell's Swamplandia, or We the Drowned by Carsten Jensen.
    Mass marketed fiction serves it's purpose - to give individulges a light read. But they're not the all
    in all in fiction - just because they are popular for the present.
     
  20. chicagoliz
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    chicagoliz Contributing Member Contributor

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    I'm not sure what reply you're referencing here, because I don't see any that would indicate having 'struck a nerve.' Actually, the only nerve I see stricken is your own, demonstrated (in just one example) by your comment, "Thanks for calling me pointless, made my day," because that post actually said no such thing -- you were not yourself called 'pointless' and the fact that you interpret it that way speaks volumes as far as your mindset and what you are expecting and looking to hear.

    There are many people, including many authors who rally against 'popular fiction,' and other bestsellers that they view as somehow unworthy -- whether they believe they are shallow, poorly written, vapid, trite, or pointless. It is true that there are many published works that qualify, and some of them really leave some people shaking their heads. Many of these, by virtue of their popularity, make it onto the shelves of stores that don't cater specifically to voracious readers. However, that does not mean that there are no serious, worthy, well-written, thought-provoking books published. There are, in fact, many of them -- more than I could ever read.

    Books that are both "worthy" and "unworthy" (to categorize broadly, these two types of books), also exist in the self-published world.

    The fact is, yes, it is difficult to get something published via the traditional publishing route. You have to have that right combination of a well-written book that a publisher believes will sell well. Sometimes finding the right combination of people whose opinions make up the process of getting a book published by a large publisher is very difficult to find, and it can involve a little bit of luck. But just because a publisher has to believe that there is a market for the book does not make the book unworthy in and of itself. There are people out there who are seeking "worthy" books. Traditional publishing finds many of them.

    There is no evidence that traditional publishers are going away anytime soon. Although self-publishing is a much more viable option than it was in the past, it's not poised to obliterate traditional publishers. There are many authors who are thrilled with the advent of self-publishing. It does give them more control over their work. Some decide that self-publishing is the route for them and suits them best as their first choice. No one is telling those authors that they should stop publishing that way if they are happy. There are advantages and disadvantages to both routes. However, your constant derision of traditional publishing makes your position seem like a case of sour grapes. It is possible to acknowledge the advantages and benefits of a choice other than the one you made without calling into question the basis of your own decision.

    I haven't personally had anything published yet, although I'm still polishing and haven't ventured very far yet into seeking publication. However, I know several authors who have had books published and I've talked with still others on another forum. In addition to seeing 'debut novels' at all the bookstores, on amazon, on goodreads, and in other newsletters, websites and news outlets, I know that it is not impossible for someone to get a novel published. As far as whether it will happen to me -- I certainly hope so, but I realize it's a longshot. If it doesn't, I'm not going to blame traditional publishers, though.
     
  21. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    Curiosity? I don't think so.
     
  22. Show
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    I think the music industry gets new faces all the time. Who the heck ever heard of Lady Gaga 15 years ago?

    But yeah, I can see the author's point. Perhaps Kmart is a poor sample but I suppose it does demonstrate a staleness in what's "at the top." Good thing sites like Amazon have made it so we're not a slave to what the bookstores think is popular.
     
  23. Selbbin
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    Selbbin I hate you Contributor

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    Yep.

    Who would honestly think that K-mart is the definition of what's available, especially for books? It's crazy. Try a book store.
     
  24. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    I find it interesting that the poster chose K-Mart. Not Wal-Mart or Costco, which would have emphasized volume over judgements of value. Instead, he chose K-Mart, which is pretty much perceived as the embodiment of price over quality. I hardly think this was an idle choice, but rather one chosen to get a reaction.

    Sorry, I won't dance to the music of someone else's agenda.
     
  25. Show
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    I never called publishers evil at all. :p All I said was that the Internet (via sites such as Amazon) has opened up options for us to have a wider selection of what we want to read and so we don't have to rely only on what sells well enough to be stocked on the shelves of a bookstore. Nothing there calling the bookstores or the publishers evil. I've gotten some books via Amazon that I never could've gotten if I had to rely on Borders and Barnes and Noble. (They didn't have what I wanted several times.) I fail to see how the Internet giving us more access to our choice reading published material is a bad thing or the equivalent of calling anybody "evil."
     
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