1. SquidyTheGray
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    SquidyTheGray New Member

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    Tieing characters with thier guns.

    Discussion in 'Character Development' started by SquidyTheGray, Dec 6, 2012.

    Yeah it's cliche, but I thought I'd check to see if anyone had any advice on this as it is an under looked part of creating a character in stories where violence happens more often than not.
    While making some character outlines I realized that these guys need guns(well duh) I looked at some more or less well know action hero's and tried to dissect how they tied a particular weapon to characters. I didn't see much of a trend (prime example Otonashi [of Angel Beats] uses a glock-17 2nd-gen most of the time) other than that the character makes the gun interesting and not the other way around. (i.e. Bond's PPK, which is actually pretty ineffective against anyone armed)
    Does anyone have some recommendations?
     
  2. James Berkley
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    James Berkley Banned

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    being someone who uses and owns a lot of firearms i think that diffident brands and models have personalities. you notice that bond switched away from the PKK a few times ( after being issued it over a Beretta) but it was always a Walther.

    as another example think about how much Taurus gets ragged on. their quality has greatly improved but people still talk trash about it.

    if you can give the character whatever you want, maybe think of a brands image they are similar too. or think of one that does not have many associations with it. if they are in a organization where a gun is issued, give them what is issued
     
  3. cmshepard
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    cmshepard Member

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    Glad to meet another enthusiast.

    I do the same, and in fact just wrote a short story (very) loosely based on my husband and myself.
    I have an M1 carbine that my grandfather carried in Korea, and someone before him carried into WWII. I identify with the rifle, simply because it's close range and I'm used to pistols. Of course they aren't allowed in this state without extensive permits, so my "babies" are at home in my dad's gun safe. Sorry about the tangent, but anyway, one thing that helped my story in the case of the M1 was that it had seen two battles and allowed "me" to let my instinct with pistols and its "experience" in battle take over. A bit like muscle memory.

    Before you decide on a particular weapon in your story, always always ALWAYS know your weapon. Fire it a couple of times so you know how it behaves when shot (in the instance of the M1, like a BB gun or .22 on steroids - very little kick and a BIG bang). Realize that something like a .50 cal pistol probably isn't the best choice for a petite woman (unless you just want her to be an extremely tough lady overall), and she'd probably be better suited to a .9mm (but make it a Browning .9mm hi-power, just because I love mine and it fits soooo well into tiny hands). Know that a .38 super isn't very accurate and that a .22 rifle is super accurate and the rounds tumble, doing a lot of a very different type of damage. Also, as the movies have botched so well, a six-shooter really only does have six rounds... And the typical mag for a semi-auto pistol is 9 rounds...

    That almost turned into a rant. =-/ Sorry, I love weapons of all types. Guns, especially. But, I do hope I helped you at least a little. =-]
     
  4. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    This again underscores the importance of research, and I don't just mean a few Wiki articles.

    Unless you have real handgun experience, there are nuance you will miss. You won't think about the spent cartridges flying off to the right from an automatic. You might not think of a misfeed, and having to pry a dinted cartridge out of the chamber before the weapon can be used again. You won't think about an amateur with an incorrect grip getting a torn knuckle from the slide.

    Browsing the internet is research, but it isn't Research. Know, and respect, the difference.
     
  5. Head
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    Head New Member

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    Well, I guess they would have been issued with or bought the gun with a purpose in mind, and that would probably determine the gun.

    If it was bought (by or for them), I guess it would reflect their personal research, needs and idiosyncrasies better.


    Somehow, the only fictional gun that sticks in my head was the comic Hellblazer's Ace of Winchesters for killing demons, which was a very fictional gun indeed.
     
  6. James Berkley
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    James Berkley Banned

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    Cogito has some good advise, get some range time, combine work and pleasure. :) probably will feel less like work then anything else you could ever do.
     
  7. psychotick
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    psychotick Contributing Member Contributor

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    Hi,

    I have little experience with guns, but even I know a couple of the classics. Bond and his PPK, Dirty Harry and his .44 Magnum. In my view, the choice of weapon relates more to the character's choices in using it. Dirty Harry has a big bad gun because he's a big badass and he wouldn't be happy just crippling people. They have to die. Bond wears tuxedoes so needs something that can be concealed.

    So in choosing your weapon I think you have to ask what does your character want with the gun? Does he want to kill, to carry it concealed, to not make too much of a mess or make a statement? Is he a sneaky type so might want something with a silencer? Is he an ex cop and so probably familiar with Glock nine mls? Long barrel for accuracy? Shorter barrel so it can be concealed in a hand?

    Just some thoughts.

    Cheers, Greg.
     
  8. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    Ian Flaming was, surprisingly, not very familiar with handguns, although not completely inexperienced. His first two James Bond novels had Bond using a Beretta 418. But Fleming received a letter from a retired army officer, Major Geoffrey Boothroyd, who referred to the Beretta as "a lady's gun" with no real stopping power. After some discussion with Fleming, Boothroyd suggested Bond use the Walther PPK instead.

    The moral of the story? Fleming's first two novels, Casino Royale and Dr. No, were no less popular for the poor handgun choice. The other moral is, don't hesitate to speak with someone who has the knowledge you need if your personal knowledge falls short.
     
  9. captain kate
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    captain kate Active Member

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    I definitely agree. Although, Cog, don't have your thumb sticking up when you fire a Glock...I've seen people lose the top of their finger that way...

    Best thing I can recommend is, if you have one, drop by a local firing range because you'll find someone who's knowledgeable and could possibly help you with research. A gun shop can too. I happen to own a Glock 17 and wouldn't trade it for anything. With one in the chamber and an 18 round magazine, it can fire 19 shots before reload.

    Then you get into issues like powder grains..jacketed hollow points vs full metal jacket. Firearms will definitely require research unless you're knowledgeable on the subject.
     
  10. mg357
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    mg357 Active Member

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    There is a movie firearms database website i look at the different celebrities listed there and the guns they have used in the differents movies and t.v. they have done and use one of those guns and base the character on that celebrity in some way shape or form.

    I also own a collection of gun books and use those books for my gun help as well.

    if you need any suggestions for books to use for your gun research please let me know.
     
  11. SuperVenom
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    SuperVenom Contributing Member

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    Well not sure if it helps but the animie trigun does that sort of thing, Each character has a gun that personifies their character.
     
  12. SquidyTheGray
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    SquidyTheGray New Member

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    Thanks for the advice, but the replies have given rise to another question what's the focus on hand-guns. I mean I have a g-17 myself but I wouldn't carry that thing into active combat unless it was a side-arm to something that fires 5.56's or bigger. I was personally thinking about giving the characters PDW's and a Taurus Raging Bull for the squad sergeant.(FYI this is millitary sc-fi) The PDW's seamed like a good option as they are compact, easily silenced, and pack a serious punch. (gotta love those 7.62 rounds)
     
  13. captain kate
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    captain kate Active Member

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    You can update the M16, Styre or whatever you want. I've updated Glock's to newer metals, with the same design, in my novel. I've also used Styre and Sig rifles for ground combat. One thing about Sci Fi is you can always update the tech to fit what you want. Mine still fire bullets, but 14mm armor piercing rounds in combat rifles, with mobile tanks (both tracked and able to move on two legs) using .50 mini guns.
     
  14. James Berkley
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    James Berkley Banned

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    ok so its Sc-fi. NICE!

    i think a lot of it is going to depend on how far in the future, but its something you can really go hog wild with

    personally in my story, pretty much every weapon uses case less ammo.
     
  15. B93
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    B93 Active Member

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    My favorite example of an author who should have known better is in Heinlein's story (Beyond This Horizon, I think) where everybody else is using ray guns and his protagonist uses a 1911 model .45 caliber.

    He describes the guy firing it, and then after the situation calms down showing it to a friend who was curious. The story describes every detail of his actions, removing the magazine, etc. and then he hands it to the friend and tells him it's disarmed, "I pulled its teeth". Nowhere does he mention pulling the slide to get the round out of the chamber. No one who has significant experience with semiauto weapons should make that mistake.

    Kate, 14 mm armor piercing as a general service rifle? My shoulder aches from the thought.
     
  16. Cogito
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    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    Why wouldn't a soldier carry a sidearm as well as an automatic rifle? Sidearms may be a better choice in tight quarters, and also serve as a backup if the assault rifle misfires or is damaged.

    The point is not what particular type of weapon is chosen, but rather what lies behind those decisions.
     
  17. captain kate
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    captain kate Active Member

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    Cog's absolutely correct in his comment. If you look at US soldiers, male or female, they carry Beretta 92FS's, while others carry the ubiquitous Glock. My four sisters have their sig saur rifles for main combat, and the sidearm for back up. No soldier, in reality, would go into combat without a sidearm. What would they do when the rifle ran out of bullets. Keep in mind, a full load of bullets is only 210-230 rounds for soldiers-which is why they don't go automatic unless necessary. So, once the rifle empties, and you're in close quarters, out comes the pistol.

    Character's can make the decision for what kind of weapons they want to use or you as the author can. Just up to you. That's me .02
     
  18. cmshepard
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    cmshepard Member

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    Also, the type of soldier matters.

    Not all opt for handguns, and not all have the choice. Those in close-quarters (particularly those who must enter locked doors) carry the M4 but also have a shotgun. The handgun is typically for officers, though more soldiers do carry them than what was once the case.

    Also, don't look away from non-firing weapons (such as throwing knives, tomahawks, grenades, flashbangs, etc). They do have grenades and flash grenades, and some (such as my husband) opt to carry a tomohawk as well.

    Also, if it's a sci-fi novel, why not create your own to fit the time/genre? That seems like a fun idea and requires less research. You could make the gun specifically for your character rather than trying to fit one to it from personal knowledge. The imagination is a fine thing.
     
  19. mg357
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    mg357 Active Member

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    I am a student of military history and of military weapons i some knowledge on this subject: Special Forces operators carry an m4 carbine and a beretta m9 or some other sort of 9mm or .45 caliber semi automatic pistol. if there doing building searches one man on the team will carry a breaching shotgun for opening doors if they are locked some times when there is a lot of cqb or close quarters battle they will carry submachine guns like an mp5.

    If there is a sniper or two on the team they will use a sniper rifle such as an m21 which is semi-automatic in case there are lots of bad guys that need to be killed or they will use a bolt action rifle like an m24.

    also at least one man on an SF team will carry a belt fed machine gun like an m249 squad automatic weapo or saw. and some of these operators or all of them will carry some for of a fixed bladed nice like a ka-bar
    and a pocket knife or a multi tool some times they may carry both.

    I hope this imformation will be helpful
     
  20. captain kate
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    captain kate Active Member

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    Oh you should hear what a friend on mine carried in 'Nam when on his black ops. However, the standard side arm for regular troops is the Beretta 92FS
     
  21. cmshepard
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    cmshepard Member

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    I get the same with my husband. He repairs weapons and (aside from hearing all of the crazy guns people carry), he's always coming home with a new tomohawk (we have 4 now, seriously, 4) and about 5 Ka-bars. I think there's even a machete and bowie knife floating around, plus Gerber crap everywhere. I'm not complaining, when he gets new ones I get to play with the old stuff - teehee.
     
  22. James Berkley
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    James Berkley Banned

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    wish my SO brought home so many toys, she keeps telling me i have too many.
     
  23. SquidyTheGray
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    SquidyTheGray New Member

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    Okay so thanks to the advice I got here I came to this list.
    M Sgt. Ernie D. Dalezna- m13-9 Beretta Mach. Pistol
    Cpl. Garry Kildow- APR-7.62x51mm, m13-9 Beretta Mach. Pistol
    Pfc. Pete Santilli- APRc-5.56x45mm, m13-2 Beretta
    Pfc. Shank- APRc-5.56x45mm, m13-2 Beretta
    Cpl. Lockwood- Stoner63 (updated for SOPMOD), m13-2 Beretta
    L Cpl. Allan- APRc-5.56x45mm, m13-2 Beretta

    And the guns I've modified to suit my needs:
    APRc-5.56x45mm “Trench Rat”- Selective fire sub-compacted PDW. Fires 5.56x45mm rounds. Issued to members of the 530th regiment, which works almost exclusively on missions pertaining to intelligence and R&D.
    APR-5.56x45mm – Fully automatic combat rifle with a “bull-pup” action. The Anti-Personnel Rifle is an assault-rifle class weapon commonly used by the Canadian Infantry Corps and other NATO countries as a standard issue weapon of choice.
    APR-7.62x51mm – Selective fire (burst/semi-auto/safe) battle rifle used by the Canadian Marine Corps as a standard issue rifle. Also sees use by NATO armies as a specialist sniper. Most commonly operated in semi-automatic mode, the burst capability was added upon request of the Canadian Marine Corps.
    m13-2 Beretta- Composite blend semi-automatic handgun produced by Beretta for the Canadian infantry. Low-Medium fire rate and case-less shells make it fairly resistant to jamming.
    M13-9 Beretta- Machine Pistol variant of the m13. Fires the same sized cartridge, but in a cased design to compensate for the internal complexity added by the automatic receiver. This model didn't inherit it's more common parent's resistance to jam.
     

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