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  1. Songshie

    Songshie Member

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    Why would a villain tell their plan to their enemy?

    Discussion in 'Plot Development' started by Songshie, Dec 20, 2016.

    In my story, Vida is cornered in the cockpit with a Being who then explains who they are and why they are invading. What would be some good reasons for a foot solider to tell their enemy their plans? It's very important that she learns this info at that specific time, but if you have other suggestions, that's fine too.
     
  2. antlad

    antlad Banned

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    The simple answer of why villains tell their plans is simple ego. Superheroes, James Bond, whoever. "I have you right where I want you, and you can't escape! Since you can't escape, there is no reason to not tell you how you, and everyone else is going to die! Mwahahaha1"
    Or; "I am finally going to kill you, so I am going to tell you so you are scared while dying."
     
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  3. Catrin Lewis

    Catrin Lewis Contributing Member Contributor

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    I've always thought this was rather unbelievable as a trope, but come to think of it, I've done something similar in my WIP. In my defense, my villain is trying to blackmail/bully my protag into working for him, and he doesn't tell him everything about his plans, just enough to convince him that Resistance Is Futile. Oh, yeah, and he's holding my protag (and his girlfriend) in a location where they have no hope of escape or rescue.

    I agree with @antlad, the old "I've got you where I want you" is crucial. However, @Songshie, you've made things difficult for yourself by casting the Being that holds your Vida captive as a mere foot soldier. For him/her/it to spill the beans smacks of treason to his/her/its cause; making these grand revelations tends to be the privilege of the Big Cheese him or herself and generally happens close to the climax of the tale.

    You're not out of luck, however. If the Being has Vida merely cornered (she's still fighting, yes?) I doubt it'd outline its species' entire plan. But it may well drop some hints about the nasty things that are going to happen to her and her fellow-humans when they take over, to make her lose her nerve. And if she's smart she'll be able to figure out a lot from that.

    This isn't the ultimate confrontation, is it? If not, you have plenty of time for all to be made known.
     
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  4. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll Who wants waffles...? Contributor

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    Why not have go on an espionage mission to gain the intel?

    Getting the big evil plan from a grunt doesn't make a lot of sense. (Regardless if it is forced or willing)
    They could be just feeding a line of BS, to bolster themselves as being important.
    Someone with authority wouldn't offer up such intel without some persuasion.
    Having the baddie ramble off in a monologue about their great evil scheme
    feels a bit cliche, and a lot like a cartoon.

    Perhaps your MC comes across a folder, binder, computer thing, that
    reveals the dark sinister plan on a recon/infiltration run.
    Think about it logically. You have a plot/Cabal, etc., that you want to
    go as smoothly as it can. Why would you brag about it before it has
    come to be actualized and carried out in its entirety?
    The short run down is you would not, because exposing such sensitive
    info means it will get attention and not the kind you want. So having
    a tight lip stance until after it is said and done is a much better way
    to approach things. Less likely to be foiled, and you can boast of your
    deeds once they have already been carried out.

    While we don't know just how arrogant your enemy element is, it would
    take a fair amount for them to speak openly about their agenda.
     
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  5. halisme

    halisme Contributing Member Contributor

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    If I ever become a supervillian and a hero comes to stop me, I'm just going to tell them a totally different plan than the one I'm doing.
     
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  6. mrieder79

    mrieder79 Not a ground squirrel

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    If this being is getting ready to waste Vida, then some good ol' gloating may be in order. Maybe the being comes from a race that considers itself above humans. Maybe its a religious crusade and they are weeding out all the infidels from the galaxy.

    On the other hand, my initial reaction to the scene you've set up is not favorable. It sounds like you are gettind ready to do a massive plot dump. Tread carefully or it will kill the pace of your story. It also builds tension to keep the plan hidden. Focus more on energy, stakes, and tension than making sure the reader has a detailed roadmap of the plot.
     
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  7. Foxxx

    Foxxx The Debonair Supporter

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    Now *that*, @halisme, is something I'd love to see in a story. Maybe one of my own stories... (insert evil laugh)

    But pretty much what the others said. Either consider

    a) the foot-soldier does not reveal the entire plan, but instead accidentally drops a couple big hints in the midst of the excitement
    b) replace the foot-soldier with a higher-rank who would realistically know the plans--and wouldn't be committing treason by doing so
    c) scrap this part, and restructure the plot to include a mission where the protag discovers enemy intelligence

    And as @mrieder79 pointed out, you're in that part of the map that has a sea-monster drawn on it, and reads "Beware Plot-dumps".
     
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  8. halisme

    halisme Contributing Member Contributor

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    @Foxxx My other fun idea is that in the traditional "I have poisoned your loved one, and will only give you the antidote for the mugiffin" is that the villain doesn't give them it. It's actually a stronger poison. Just say it takes a while to work.
     
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  9. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll Who wants waffles...? Contributor

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    Ah, @halisme, you diabolical bear you.
    That is actually quite the cunning your part.
     
  10. Selbbin

    Selbbin I hate you Contributor

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    In your scenario I don't see any reason for the alien to do so. Find another way.
     
  11. halisme

    halisme Contributing Member Contributor

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    @Cave Troll To me it just seemed like common sense.
     
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  12. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll Who wants waffles...? Contributor

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    @halisme

    You cunning magnificent bastard you. :supersmile:

    I gives you a hug, for your brilliance. :friend:
     
  13. halisme

    halisme Contributing Member Contributor

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    @Cave Troll The hug is poisoned Thank you.
     
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  14. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributing Member Contributor

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    @halisme I am going to use that

    That depends as much on the plan itself as it does on the person telling it.

    An ideological fanatic would see the message as the weapon itself: if he dies after spreading his message, then the enemy will relay the message and potentially entice a new follower later down the line, and if the enemy dies, then the fanatic lives to try again tomorrow.

    Tactical information, on the other hand, the soldier might not even have in the first place depending on how their chain of command is structured.
     
  15. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll Who wants waffles...? Contributor

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    It is only poisoned with beer sir.
     
  16. halisme

    halisme Contributing Member Contributor

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    If anyone else wants to make their villains competent, I run a free service where I look over any plans, dramatic monologues, or general actions. This charity is free and exists to help young antagonists get the right start in life, or unlife for the undead.
     
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  17. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributing Member Contributor

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    About a year ago I came up with a bank robbery scenario that I loved, and a few months ago I discovered a way to turn it into a legitimate WIP:
    A pair of bank robbers – the boss and the face – are casing a building for a new job. They tried the day before, but one of their targets was destroyed in a bombing and now their friend is unconscious in a hospital bed.

    As they're deciding that security is too tight, an agent of the FBI walks in and says that she has a copy of a manifesto that was sent claiming responsibility for the bombing. She says that the bomber had taken a hostage, strapped him into a suicide bomb vest, and told that he would be starring in a 30 Minutes or Less scenario where he has to walk into a bank, tell them that he will die if they don't give him a bunch of money, but then the bomber sets him off anyway before he has a chance to ask.

    The manifesto explains that this scheme had been tried in real life before being made into a movie, and it didn't work because the bomb was on a timer instead of on a remote, and as such the bank chose to call the police and try to have the bomb defused. The hostage died, but the bomber didn't get any money. This copy-cat bomber not only used a remote control instead of a timer, but forced the first victim to serve as a test run to show the next bank that she was serious about being willing to kill innocent people.

    "At this point, I should hope that the cleverer among you have pieced together that I am not actually here on behalf of the FBI."
     
  18. halisme

    halisme Contributing Member Contributor

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    Firstly, robbing banks is not the best way to earn money from robbing banks ironically. The best method is to go for the armoured trucks they use to move money around, while they do carry less, you're a lot less likely to be caught, though the character might not know that.
    The first question comes from the range of the remote. If it's short range, she risks being caught in the blast, and unfortunately, I don't know enough about long-range radio signals, so for all I know they could be interceptable.
    Question 2, how is she making these bombs? The easy way is fertiliser and sugar but that can put you on a lot of watch lists, not to mention that it's horribly unstable. The best way is, unfortunately, something I do not know.
    Qustion 3, is she targeting banks in the same area, because if it's too local, there might be some issues there. I'd recommend hitting different companies as well. You'd also want to go for as many as quickly as possible so they don't have time to bulk up security.
     
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  19. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributing Member Contributor

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    My protagonists are only trying bank robbery because they're desperate – they built a drug operation by borrowing from a loan shark, the operation was destroyed, and they still need to pay him back – but the bomber's not doing it for the money, she just likes reading about the likes of Al Capone, Jeffrey Dahmer, and Timothy McVeigh and wants to read about herself in years to come.

    I just realized that my flip answers to these questions need some work, so I will think it over and get back to you with more detail.
     
  20. WNP

    WNP Member

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    Maybe Vida defeats the Being, and searching through its things, finds a document/electronic devise with its orders on? (all depends what type of being the Being is though I guess. If it's some type of spirit creature it probably won't have a pack to search through)
     
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  21. hawls

    hawls Active Member

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    Why is it so important? If Vida does not get this information at this point in time what will happen? Are the heroes of this story only able to achieve victory through an increasingly implausible string of contrivances?

    I agree with @Selbbin. From what you've told us there is no reason for the Being to tell Vida anything. And it may not even know all the details. Maybe it cannot communicate at all. It may have had this ability impaired somehow to prevent it from revealing details of the invasion. That seems like something an evil Super Being would do.

    Is this your first draft? Are you in the planning stage? Because you have encountered one of those problems the solution to which is to, as has been said, find another way.
     
  22. tonguetied

    tonguetied Contributing Member Contributor

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    I think you have two parts to your post, the first sentence seems very acceptable, the protag explains why they are doing what they are doing. The second part has all the problems as listed in previous posts, and the suggestion that Vida figures out the plan details through other means seems the most logical to me as WNP suggested. Even over hearing some commands from the protags communicator might work and as hawls has asked why is it important?
     
  23. Songshie

    Songshie Member

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    It's my first draft. I've written the first four or so chapters, but I want to plan out the rest so that the story won't die of writer's block later. I like the idea about not being able to communicate. Thanks.
     
  24. Songshie

    Songshie Member

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    I changed it, and she only learns a part of the plan and that is from deduction, not from getting info handed to her. Thanks for the ideas.
     
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  25. zoupskim

    zoupskim Contributing Member Contributor

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    I mean... they wouldn't. Real people don't tell their opponents their plans, not even as a trick, because if you captured your enemy you'd just keep them in the dark or trade them for other prisoners or negotiation leverage.
     

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