How much can you realistically make e-publishing?

Counterpoint: http://www.digitalspy.com/movies/fifty-shades-of-grey/feature/a820703/worst-50-shades-darker-quotes/

 

How is that a counterpoint? Fifty Shades wasn't self published? It isn't a novel? It didn't make money for the author? What, in the post that you're quoting, are you counterpointing?

 

It's a counterpoint to the perceived invalidity of my statement regarding its poor writing and harmful message.

 

So maybe you should respond to a post that you're disagreeing with instead of some random post? In what post did someone say that Fifty Shades has a good message and dandy writing? Please quote it.

 

Fair point. My original point was that if you're not writing hardcore porn, you are less likely to have an instant bestseller.

 

My understanding is that it's pretty soft porn, but we could probably argue a lot about that, and since I haven't read it (and I suspect you haven't either?) it wouldn't be a very informed argument.

However, my second point would be that I doubt that porn alone is going to make a bestseller either. There are plenty of corporations making hardcore porn. 50 Shades just pushed a button. It's an anomaly, a lightning strike. It's pornlike nature is really not all that relevant.

 

I honestly think EL James was cashing in on the same phenomenon as the movie 9 1/2 weeks did back in the 80's. Every once in a while some kind of entertainment will come along that presents a niche subculture like BDSM in a way that it goes mainstream for a while. Back after 9 1/2 weeks came out there were all kinds of staid suburban ladies who wanted their staid suburban hubbies to start tying them up all of the sudden. Sometimes these things hit pop culture at just the right time, and boom, overnight success. I think it's timing and luck more than anything else. I'm half waiting for knotting to become mainstream considering the massive amount of shape-shifter/were-porn material out there.

I've not read all of FSOG, but the three or so sex scenes I read were relatively tame compared to the level of heat I like to read and write at. I think it's most titillating to readers who aren't used to reading really raunchy sex scenes. Most of my friends/family/co-workers who've read 50 Shades had never read a book with explicit BDSM content before, so to them it seemed all edgy and forbidden based on comments they made to me back when I felt like the only middle-aged, middle class white woman who wasn't obsessed with the books. The hilarious thing is that I honestly think some of them thought I wasn't into it because I'm a prude, when in fact I was more like "This is nothing new to me, and I have in fact written filthier porn on my computer sitting 10 feet away from you at work, Jane."

 

Just dropping by to remind everyone to keep the conversation on the original topic, more or less anyway.

Whether FSOG is violent porn or soft erotica can be debated in the Book Discussion subforum.

 

????

It's been commonplace in schooling, at least in the UK, for schools to not let their less-able students take harder exams because it would reduce the average result they report to the government, which would lower their ranking in the school tables. This used to be institutionalized, in that the less-able kids wouldn't even take the same kind of exams as the more able.

Back to publishing, it's not exactly news that a lot of midlist writers aren't getting their calls returned by publishers any more, and that new writers whose first couple of books don't become bestsellers aren't being asked to submit another. Even some writers who've hit the bestseller lists in the past have been complaining that publishers don't want their new books because they're not bestseller-y enough.

If you're not aware of that, I'd say you're not reading enough author blogs. Publishers switching to the Hollywood-style 'bestseller or bust!' model is a common topic there.

 

Oh, that's what you'd say? I'd say you're listening to some dodgy sources and also didn't understand my post. Try taking the chip off your shoulder and reading more widely.

 

AFAIR, the FSOG writer was a TV producer? If so, that probably had a lot to do with its success: the easiest way to have a best-seller is to get it plastered all over the media.

 

I had relatives who wrote paper books with a real publisher and the income was just enough to pay for the coffe while writing it.

 

Question, if I may? I looked into CreateSpace as a way to self publish if the standard publishing rejects my series, which I suspect it will. May I ask, how satisfied are you with the results of self-publishing that route? Anything you think makes it more viable than other self-ublishing route you may have tried, if you did?

 

I would have to say it depends on the author. I have paid more than five times that for a hardback, ten times and more for a hard to find book. I think the value lies in the author's talent, the story they tell, and the value in the eye of the beholder. An e-book just means I can have it in my digital library and snatch it up quickly if I want to re-read it as opposed to searching through the bins of books that no longer fit on my bookshelves and have to be stored in my garage.

 

I can agree that the original at least was not at all representative of the reality of BDSM relationships, at least the first 100 or so pages I managed to slog through. Whether harmful or not I cannot say because I could not make it past that first 100 pages. To me the writing was YA style and bad YA at that. I will give 100 pages to any book I think I might like to see if it can eventually interest me, no matter how poorly written. Sadly for me, I bought the entire trilogy because I had friends (not of the lifestyle, vanilla types) who thought it was wonderful, who oh-ed and ah-ed over it. I have since ceased trusting their opinions on books.

 

Well it has been an ongoing question in my mind. How come a well known dead authors
novel in ebook format that is considerably longer (and more likely better written), only
be 99c? Yet some new book that is shorter and the author is not all that well known (if
at all) go for $5-6+, and may not compete with the former in a given genres.

At least with a solid book you have some value it retains. Not that I don't find the price of
a brand new paperback to be a tad high at $10, or a hardback at $20. It is just the price
of the times (which shows how much profit publishers want for materials that do not
cost more than a fraction of a dollar at their price wholesale.

So if a paperback is 10 and the ebook is 6, what the hell am I paying for? I understand
material costs for a paperback, but what exactly am I paying for with an ebook other
than digital words that won't stay saved on my limited memory Kindle? Cause if it is
written like shit, I would feel cheated out of 6 bucks. At least with the paperback I can
resell it and get something back for my shit investment. Which will not work with an
ebook.

From a consumer stand point, I feel like I am getting hosed in the ordeal due to higher
profit margins on something that takes a lot less effort on the part of the one posting it.
Thats my rub with the solid vs. digital book pricing.

 

The first 2.5 chapters don't have anything to do with BDSM (Though your statement is not inaccurate).
It really is poorly written. It just about bored me to tears with how tedious and dull the writing was.

 

LOL Isn't it funny how certain women are judged to be prudish based on the look they present in public, but in reality are anything but!

 

Well as I am new to digital purchasing and only buy stories from authors I know I will love at this point, I do not have a frame of reference. I can see your point if buying a digital FSOG level story for the prices I pay for a Koontz, Brown, Gerritsen, etc. I would rant a lot more than you have over the expense wasted!

Damn, you just made me realize I can run to Half-Price Books and sell the atrocious trilogy and recoup some of my loss! I just tossed the trilogy in the garage in a bin and counted it as money wasted! Thanks!

 

Exactly! I couldn't remember if there was BDSM in the portion I read as it was so long ago and I blocked the writing from my mind. If that is an example of the type of writing that makes money self-publishing, I am doomed.

 

How much money are you getting from selling used paperbacks? I think I got about a dollar a book last time I did it, which was, admittedly, a while ago, but even if you multiply that by four, it'd still be a break-even point between your hypothetical ebooks and paperbacks.

That said, I don't think the value of a book is in its resale. It's the experience of reading that I'm paying for. And that experience is pretty much the same (or, for me, even better) with e-books.

 

I have been very satisfied with self publishing with good sales and, for E&D, excellent ranking on Amazon. But publishing is only the first part. If you self publish, you must also self-market, and many authors fail to follow through with this. If a tree falls in the forest, and no one hears it, did it make a sound? If the best novel ever written is listed on Amazon, and no one knows it is there, will anyone ever read it?

CreateSpace is ridiculously easy to use, just copy your roughly-formatted manuscript and paste it into their Word template for the book size you selected, job done, funky margins taken care of. Go through for minor details, fancy header footers, etc, graphics alignment, etc. Go to Amazon and look inside E&D (full title below). That took about a week, most of which was spent tweaking the 20 or so internal graphics to make sure they were readable, the right size and position, etc. That was my second book, CFM being the first. CS will then take you to KDP to publish your e-book, and provide you a Kindle-ready Word doc and cover ready for upload or for intermediate editing... I get rid of copyright page and everything else so the Kindle version goes straight to text. From the time you think your paperback version is ready to go in CS layout, to on line in Amazon, is one hour of your time, then about 24 hours, waiting for them to review your work. CS also has very responsive and profession telephone tech support (KDP does not).

Cautionary note! Do not rush to publish! Make sure your story is excruciatingly edited. If you are not sick of looking at it one more time, you are not done! You will never get a second chance to make a good first impression. Make sure you order a proof paper copy before launch. However, if you discover a typo or typos in your book after publishing, no matter. Just upload a new interior. I did that about three times in each book. No harm, no foul. Since this is print-on-demand, there are no stacks of already printed paper copies, except for those you may have already ordered. You can order as many personal copies as you like at production cost plus shipping, at any time, to any address, to preposition for book signings or as gifts.

As to the wide range in Amazon ePub pricing, Amazon's relationship with traditional publishers forces those to charge much more more for eBooks, typically $9.99 to $12.99 or more, while self-publishers can go as low as $0.99.

 

@BayView fair point.