A x-ray of an one hit wonder...

Discussion in 'Word Mechanics' started by irite, May 29, 2018.

  1. mashers

    mashers Contributor Contributor Community Volunteer

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2016
    Messages:
    2,323
    Likes Received:
    3,089
    It’s not my fault. I’m from Colchester. It’s an affliction on many levels.
     
    matwoolf likes this.
  2. matwoolf

    matwoolf Banned Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2012
    Messages:
    6,631
    Likes Received:
    10,135
    Location:
    Yorkshire
    You're safe now.
     
    Alan Aspie and EstherMayRose like this.
  3. matwoolf

    matwoolf Banned Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2012
    Messages:
    6,631
    Likes Received:
    10,135
    Location:
    Yorkshire
    Well, I've come back to the North that I departed in '73. The chaps, I find, by and large accept me for my ponce-gob, soften gibberish something something...

    ...

    But I recall - working with my Sussex ruffians - back in the day - the ethno-hostility toward the Yorkshire 'mob' contractors. Of course, it was tongue in cheek. Sometimes I wasn't so sure.

    My main problem is my falsetto greeting - the 'hi,' or 'ged minning.' Planning to drop it an octave, give my presentation some oomph/gravitas.
     
  4. irite

    irite Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2018
    Messages:
    163
    Likes Received:
    174
    Location:
    Wikipedia's Avery
    I'm guessing if you were teased about your southern accent, then they were northerners... If so they were jealous you even had a bath let alone took a bath (I'm from the south in case it doesn't show)... Also nowdays having a baf is a word for, er, well, female alone time for a bit of DIY
     
    EstherMayRose likes this.
  5. matwoolf

    matwoolf Banned Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2012
    Messages:
    6,631
    Likes Received:
    10,135
    Location:
    Yorkshire
    It has always been an option.
     
  6. EstherMayRose

    EstherMayRose Gay Souffle Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2017
    Messages:
    1,744
    Likes Received:
    3,256
    Location:
    Actually Decent Uni Halls
    Yeah, North Wales. My current school is an independent school, so we've got a bit of a different pool of accents.
     
  7. matwoolf

    matwoolf Banned Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2012
    Messages:
    6,631
    Likes Received:
    10,135
    Location:
    Yorkshire
    Some of those North Welsh people struggle at university with their frogs and spells - amidst the hearty Berkshire types. It's the never-ending struggle.
     
  8. irite

    irite Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2018
    Messages:
    163
    Likes Received:
    174
    Location:
    Wikipedia's Avery
    I shouldn't be so rude, thats one of my favourite parts of the UK. One of the oddest thing I've heard was from the farmer at the Llanberis campsite, when i told him I was going up Glyder Fawr and accross to Fach, he recoiled, his eye's went all big and he said, "bloody steep up there boy I tell you, even the sheep don't like it up there". It was like a horror film when the locals in the pub hear you talk of a legend and they go silent then the old man in the corner says we don't talk about the legend round here... I don't know how I stopped myself laughing.
     
  9. EstherMayRose

    EstherMayRose Gay Souffle Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2017
    Messages:
    1,744
    Likes Received:
    3,256
    Location:
    Actually Decent Uni Halls
    M'afraid those place names mean nothing to me.
     
  10. irite

    irite Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2018
    Messages:
    163
    Likes Received:
    174
    Location:
    Wikipedia's Avery
    Snowdonia, Llanberis is pretty much Snowdon itself, Glyders are names of peaks. Glyder Fawr/Fach are the other side of the valley to Snowdon.
     
    matwoolf likes this.
  11. EstherMayRose

    EstherMayRose Gay Souffle Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2017
    Messages:
    1,744
    Likes Received:
    3,256
    Location:
    Actually Decent Uni Halls
    Yeah, Llanberis rang a bell. I've been to Snowdonia many times. I did my DofE practice expedition there. We might actually have camped at Llanberis. I once went up Snowdon on the train with school, and then at the top everyone bought stuff that said "I climbed the hard way"!
     
  12. srwilson

    srwilson Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2017
    Messages:
    259
    Likes Received:
    111
    Location:
    London
    I've lived in London for the last 20 years now and was born in Essex, lived there for 10 years, but have never ever heard people say 'yourn' or 'hern'. However, strangely enough, when I lived in Norfolk, people sometimes would say 'yourn'. I think it's very rare.
     
  13. srwilson

    srwilson Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2017
    Messages:
    259
    Likes Received:
    111
    Location:
    London
    Not quite. It's the eff sound.
     
  14. srwilson

    srwilson Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2017
    Messages:
    259
    Likes Received:
    111
    Location:
    London
    This one's is a real silly one. IMO the very soft 'h' in history is just as soft a the 'w' in well. People say 'an historic event' because the h is soft, but yet they don't say 'it was an well'. So really this doesn't make sense.

    I wouldn't joke about the 'haitch', because it is genuinely catching on.
     
  15. srwilson

    srwilson Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2017
    Messages:
    259
    Likes Received:
    111
    Location:
    London
    I hear 'erb' a lot in the US, but never in the UK, unless it's a mispronunciation. You can't call it an accent, it's dropping the 'h', so it's really just laziness.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2018
  16. srwilson

    srwilson Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2017
    Messages:
    259
    Likes Received:
    111
    Location:
    London
    What's also becoming popular in London, is 'a egg', where 'an' is like some alien word!
     
  17. mashers

    mashers Contributor Contributor Community Volunteer

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2016
    Messages:
    2,323
    Likes Received:
    3,089
    Of course it is. Omitting initial ‘h’ is a feature of many English accents.

    Actually a glottal stop requires more energy to produce than /h/, so technically it’s more lazy to pronounce the ‘h’.
     
  18. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    10,462
    Likes Received:
    11,689
    I don't follow this - there's no consonant sound at all when I pronounce "historical" and there's a clear consonant sound when I pronounce "well". I've got a pretty standard Canadian accent - what accent do you have?
     
    ChickenFreak likes this.
  19. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2016
    Messages:
    22,566
    Likes Received:
    25,882
    Location:
    East devon/somerset border
    nope, if it's said EFF Ayee Quuee then its An because Efff starts with an e

    If however you say it FACK like nearly everyone does then due to FFFF being a consonant sound its 'a'
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2018
    Alan Aspie likes this.
  20. srwilson

    srwilson Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2017
    Messages:
    259
    Likes Received:
    111
    Location:
    London
    Dropping the 'h' might be associated with accents, but if you say phone instead of telephone, that's not an accent, it's a contraction. Dropping 'h' is literally a contraction.

    A glottal stop might use more energy (well, debatable), but it's still easier to pronounce.
     
  21. srwilson

    srwilson Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2017
    Messages:
    259
    Likes Received:
    111
    Location:
    London
    I have a mostly Essex, England accent. I don't know what you mean by 'consonant sound'. Do you say 'history' as if there is no 'h'? And how would you say 'well'? Does it sound similar to the name 'Manuel', if you remove the 'man'?
     
  22. mashers

    mashers Contributor Contributor Community Volunteer

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2016
    Messages:
    2,323
    Likes Received:
    3,089
    What does that have to do with it? There are several ways of contracting words. Removing syllables is a morphological change associated with dialect. Removing phonemes is a phonological change associated with both accent and dialect. I don’t really know why this is a point of discussion.

    No, it isn’t. A glottal stop is pronounced by completely adducting the vocal folds. The diaphragm is then engaged which increases both sub- and intra-glottal pressure. The vocal folds are then rapidly abducted, and the sudden release of pressure is what makes the sound. A /h/, in contrast, is made with a completely open glottis. There is no vocal fold adduction, and nether sub- nor intra-glottal air pressure, or resistance to the flow of air of any kind. So a glottal stop is objectively ‘harder’ to pronounce.
     
  23. EstherMayRose

    EstherMayRose Gay Souffle Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2017
    Messages:
    1,744
    Likes Received:
    3,256
    Location:
    Actually Decent Uni Halls
    Go Mashers.
     
  24. BayView

    BayView Huh. Interesting. Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2014
    Messages:
    10,462
    Likes Received:
    11,689
    I usually pronounce the "h" in history, but I don't usually pronounce any "h" in historic or historical.

    And, no, I'd pronounce Manuel as three syllables... Man-u-el... I don't pronounce "well" as "u-el". I don't know of a way to indicate the pronunciation of "well" other than just how it's written... a "whu" sound at the start, followed by "ell", but all one syllable... How do you pronounce it?
     
  25. srwilson

    srwilson Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2017
    Messages:
    259
    Likes Received:
    111
    Location:
    London
    Well, you've used lots of interesting words, but not accurately.

    Vocal chords take less energy to control than the diaphragm. Saying a fully pronounced 'h' (like you would say 'huh!') requires considerably more control of the diaphragm and takes more energy. It also DOES require a contraction of the glottis. It also does involve considerable air pressure, almost as forceful as the 'explosion' of the hard consonants, such as 'p'. Unless you have a very different way of pronouncing it!
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice