lol In normal day to day life they are not real, its not a mental illness. I don't think it is important to keep a grip on reality during the time I am writing. I don't when I am reading a book or watching a TV show. When I write I am very definitely not in the real world, I am part of the story. Its my way of approaching it. My chracters have more than proven themselves capable of making good decsions. And it works for me. I have a good story, that myself and others are enjoying reading. Actually my intial query came out of a situation that is a good example. I didn't want my characer to be evil. I went on to write it and she came up with a better story and a much better idea. Like when I didn't want to kill off one and he ran away with his lover instead, that has allowed him to come back. I know its my subconcious, but because its not my conscious brain making the decision its feels like its my character If I hadn't been that attached to these characters the solutions I would have come up with wouldn't have been as good, and would have been less appropriate for that character.
but their imagination is so much better lol Mine will still say things and do things my conscious is unprepared for. I didn't expect one of my characters to be gay, I discovered another had been chaste when he finds his girlfriend in his bedroom after a shower. I was surprised to discover the 500 year old man living in the cave and even more surprised when my main character turned into a bird. I didn't know until near the end of the book who had shot the King etc I find letting my characters lead the story telling produces ideas Charlotte wouldn't think of if she wasn't being say Bessie at the time. Its like acting you assume that role and for that time what people see isn't really you.
Exactly. If you are doing your job as a writer your characters are real. They make their own decisions. If you've developed your character effectively, the reader is going to know something is wrong is Johnny Shotgun suddenly decides that violence doesn't solve anything and opts to open diplomatic talks with Charlie Murder.
The characters are from the writer's imagination. What they say and do in the story comes from the writer's experiences and imagination. They do not exist anyhere but in the writers imagination, until their actions and statments and descriptions are recorded on paper (or computer file or orally) by the writer. The characters make the 'decisions' they do because it's what the writer imagines they would do, based on what has been imagined (and possibly recorded) before. That doesn't mean that the character doesn't develop, based on previous imagined events, for example. That's the difference between a static and dynamic character. An imagined society on a ficticious planet may develop in directions that the author didn't originally expect. That doesn't mean it is in any way real. Nor do the creatures/beasts/citizens that inhabit the planet have a life of their own. Maybe my definition of real differs from what others define as being real. Definition: Real Definition: Imaginary Terry
My characters are not actually real, of course. It's just a fantasy I nurture to make them act more realistically (and because it's more fun that way). If I let go of my conscious control, my subconscious impulses will take over, and my characters become more nuanced and original. As I see it, it's just the literary equivalent of method acting. From Wikipedia:
I don't believe I missed your point. Read my post which followed (below). Why is it a shame? What have I said that is inaccurate? Whatever method that sparks a writer's imagination to create great fiction is perfectly fine as I see it--as long as it's legal and doesn't injure another . Terry
Agreed, I nurture ny characters, and they take on a life of their own. I choose not to control them because if I do they become less real. I prefer them to tell me what they are doing rather than tell them what to do.
Your characters have noi independent existence. Their behavior is determined solely by you, the author. If they are not controllable by you, then exactly who is controlling them? If your character doesn't behave as you expect or need, then you should be asking youself why you decided he or she would act that way. Because it was you who made that decision, and no one else. The notion that your characters are beyond your control is nonsense. Get it out of your head. It is a totally unproductive way of thinking.
There is a saying in my religion 'forget yourself and go to work.' and thats what I do with my writing. I love Islander's characters, they feel very , real and well written to me, and that is just in a short story where he hasn't had 40,000 words + to bond with his character. So it clearly works for him. I am not about to start analysing why I write the way I do, its working. I wrote intuitively for my chosen academic field, and it was successful there. I find personally telling the story more important than the writing. as when I read for me the story is more important than the writing. My characters do what is best for them, and it works. So far its produced a novel, a second one on the way, several short stories and a third story outlined. All in six months, whilst bringing up three children under 7. Even if they are rubbish - I love the story and I have readers who are devouriing them and asking for more. Thats all this writer needs, a good story. I tend to find working with my subconcious and feelings much more productive.
I am confused as to the direction and focus of this thread at this point. I have taken a second look at the original post and it would seem that the argument has altered drastically.
Why must anyone be controlling them? The majority of mental processes go on in our brains without conscious control. For example, when you play tennis, you can't think consciously of where the ball is and how you should move. You play much better if you stop thinking about it and just let your body control itself. Your conscious mind just needs to focus on the goal - where the ball should end up, not how you get it there. As if by miracle, your subconscious does the job for you. Critical thinking is best handled by conscious, rational thought. Making things appear natural is often best handled subconsciously. I guess I could train myself to make a conscious decision about everything my characters do, just as I can train myself to control every movement consciously. But I wouldn't want to.
Islander, while I could debate the logic of your assertion, in the end it wouldn't matter one way or the other. The method you employ (drawing on your imaginative subconscious--as I interpret it) works for you, and what brings you satisfaction and success in your writing works for me--and should for everyone rooting for the other writers here on this site. Terry
Obviously, though, if the character is not doing what you wanted for the story, then it isn't working for you. It's a lament I have heard here on several occasions, and it's why I stress the point that characters do not act on their own. By all means, let your subconsious drive your characters as long as that is working in your favor, But don't tell me about uncooperative, unruly characters that refuse to do as they are told. Never forget you are in control. Every aspect of the writing is in your hands, including every good or bad decision by each character.
If I had allowed my conscious to make the decision that prompted my intial question, the outcome would have been rubbish in comparison. I let the characters tell the story and I have something much better. My dilemma came because I was trying to take control of her rather than me allowing her to tell me the situation. Surely a writers forum with other writers that write in a similar way is the place to raise the frustrations with an unruly character? It doesn't mean I can't resolve the situation but it just means right now I am frustrated with them
It's not like my characters act on their own. It's more like I have a vivid sense of who they are and what they are capable of, so making them act out of character feels wrong. Their body language and speech pattern also come to me naturally when I write dialogue, with little conscious effort. If the character's personality is detrimental to the story, you have to do something about it, of course. You might have to change the character, or save them for another story, or decide that the character is more interesting than the story and build the story around them. Or you could just marry them
LOL both myself and my main character are married plus I am old enough to be his Mum it would never work. Now his Uncle Tom is a bit of alright. Hmm not sure its worth a divorce though.
I concur, it has to feel 'natural' - and of course your sub-concious can throw up all sorts of weird and wonderful things at times.
If you want to write a story about a character who leaves his wife and goes into the porn movie business, but the character you create doesn't want to do that, then you have a choice: 1) Develop a new character who WILL leave his wife and go into the porn movie business, or 2) Develop a new story for this character, in which he does what he wants to do. The only wrong alternative is to force the character to leave his wife and go into the porn movie business when he doesn't want to do that. It will be clear to the reader that the character is not doing things that are consistent with his personality. People wouldn't want to have 'Twas The Night Before Christmas end with St. Nicholas shaving his beard off, having his hair cut into a mohawk, getting swastika tattoos and riding away on a Harley Davidson hog wearing a skull-and-crossbones leather jacket and snorting cocaine. Or maybe they would want that. Depends on the audience, I guess.
