I agree with you that a lot more than determination goes into being successful. That's why I went back to school. Sure, some people can do just about anything on their own. Maybe I'm one of those people who needed a little help to take my writing to the next level. I don't think my writing goals have the kind of one-in-a-million odds. There are quite a few grants and fellowship opportunities for writers. That was another thing my university helped us prepare for and made us aware of. And since an MFA is still considered a terminal degree, you can teach at a university with it. I'm not interested in teaching right now, but I do have that option in the future. I guess you could say that it's got a built-in fall back plan. A lot of my writer friends are professors but still writing and publishing. Then I have other friends who are just writing. But I'm not trying to convince anyone to go or not go to school for writing. And many people who want to just won't get in or won't get into a place with funding they need to actually go. I was just trying to give the OP some encouragement and let them know that not everyone thinks studying something in the arts is foolish. But I don't think we have to debate it. I can understand your view and where you are coming from. I don't think you're wrong at all or giving bad advice. I was just trying to be helpful from the other side of things. I will say that if literary short stories are not a strong focus for someone, then these type of programs might not be what they are looking for.
The problem with that philosophy is that it boils down to suggesting that the hundreds of thousands of people who write and don't end up working full time at that alone simply aren't trying hard enough. Yes, there are a lot of writers who half arse a novel and wonder why they can't grab an agent or any sales on amazon, but I'm sure there are a huge number who are perfectly good writers who languish in obscurity out of misfortune. That misfortune can take a lot of forms; maybe they only get their queries seen by agents on bad days, maybe they're writing for a trend which is on its way out, who knows, but it can't simply come down to a lack of effort. That said, I do believe that if you're a genius, you'll get noticed. I can't imagine a world in which someone like Joyce was never popular, but I certainly can imagine one where Harry Potter flopped as hard as it was expected to.
Those Joyce sex letters were dreadful, right little pig. ... I don't really know, perhaps if we might somehow swap the applications of the aspiring writers with those of the aspiring politicians we might see new, clear progress on this matter? Otherwise, I suspect 'trainee writer' requires a good ten year sentence to Walmart/or to SportsDirect [UK] before inflicting weedy pen breaths upon a general population. Although present solution - as things stand - to internalise the movement - call it 'creative writing' - appears effective in limiting contagion. Creatives socialise, procreate, employ and read each other's shit - campus and such like. In short, quite unresolvable.
I honestly don't believe in the excuse of misfortune because in reality it is one of the laziest excuses that can and has been overcome with hard work and dedication. I have never seen anyone I have known who was good at writing fail as long as they put effort into it. Hell back in high school a girl in my creative writing class even got one of her poems published in a poetry book which is epic. Plenty of people who have "misfortune" have gotten out of it if they tried, but then there are the people who use it as an excuse and say "there is no other way" so they fall flat on their face whether or not they ARE good writers. If you are good and if you work hard then people will help you get you where you're going and you will MAJORLY help yourself.
Is it too personal to ask how you're making a living? Are you working at a non-writing job, or living off family, or getting social assistance, or...? If that's too personal, I understand. But for a lot of people, there just isn't the luxury of chasing a dream full time. A lot of us have to get non-writing jobs to pay the bills, and to me it makes sense to get enough education to get a good non-writing job (for whatever your definition of "good" is - good money, good hours, etc.) and then write on the side. It's just too damn hard to make a living from writing.
@Wolf Daemon, you scripted a right series of platitudes, up top, no offense. Don't do that in a book, for goodness sake, frightening enough as things stand, senator.
Um, no. A job writing for tv or movies is not selling out and a very hard thing to get. You say you wouldn't mind that kind of work because writing is fun? That's not easy work to get and all together a different field than studying literary fiction. There are several MFA programs that offer screen writing as a major. That would probably be your best bet if you are interested in studying it. Then it doesn't matter so much what your major is now. For the MFA, you have to submit a writing sample to the schools you are applying. This is where you sink or swim. If you were going for screen writing, it would be like a twenty or thirty page script. I would probably look for schools in LA or NYC if that's really your thing. If writing for tv and movies is really your back-up plan and what you consider selling out, it would just mean you have a lot to learn about the industry. Another option is since you're already in school for one major, see if you couldn't make it a double major. It might tack on another year or so. It also might make a difference if it's a BFA program or a BA program. A BFA is more likely to want you to take certain courses and be on a more structured path. And my assumption was that your plan would be to continue and get an MFA. I don't know too much about the BFA. It wasn't around when I was in undergrad.
Wait - have I got you confused with someone else? I thought you were the one who couldn't sell his stories... is that wrong? Oh, do you mean writing non-fiction? Sorry, clarification - you're making a living writing what you learned to write in your MFA?
Not at the moment but that's the plan. And yes I do. It's quite easy making a living being an author really. You just have to want it and search it out
Because without writing jobs there would be no, well society, whether that's books, movies, plays, games, etc. To even just writing something to help a person sell a product. There are plenty of jobs for it. You just have to pursue it. And at near the end of your life you may also choose to teach it.
Damn. There's all us wondering how to get agents interested and how to stand out from thousands of other submissions or how to get noticed amongst the gazillions of other self-published works, and all we really had to do was want it harder. Now why the hell don't the agents tell us that? I blame the Illuminati.
As much mockery was in that statement it is correct. You need to want it harder. You need to try different things if others aren't working for you. You need to reach out to more people and keep writing and writing. Try hard and you will succeed in what you want to do in life.
I believe it's easy to make a living from writing--as long as you want it enough--when you live under a bridge.
No, I meant actual information, not half-priced self-help bullshit. Do you have any actual information about the income levels for most authors? How are you currently paying your bills? Did you catch the humour in @Matwolf's comment about the bed at his mom's house? Are you currently living with your mom?
And of course there's the difference between writing, in general, and creative writing. Like, you make a living from writing, I think. But not from creative writing....
Then I truly feel sorry for you. I thought I joined a group of authors who enjoyed their work, not a bunch of hobbyists too scared to commit. It's rather upsetting really.
Yep. On writing forums and the like I wouldn't say I'm a full-time writer because it's not what we mean when we say that. I have a day job to pay the bills, and I write for love (and hopefully, one day, some extra income...)
You have been upset so many times today. It must be really hard for you. It's okay, though - you'll power through your misfortune. It would be lazy to let something like this bring you down. Hard work and dedication, young pup. That'll make everything better!
Then again, I say I am sorry from the deepest parts of my heart that you aren't committed enough to your art form. Too scared to walk down that path. But more for the rest of us then right.
No, absolutely. I'm just wondering if some of the wiggling on this thread is from people who are pretending it IS what we mean when we say it...
