Doctor Vs. Nurse

Discussion in 'Character Development' started by Alesia, Nov 8, 2013.

  1. KaTrian

    KaTrian A foolish little beast. Contributor

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    T and I were thinking about writing a junkie in the Army for one story, and when we did research for it, it indeed turned out plausible. We scratched that plot line for other reasons though, but I think the OP could pull this off if he wanted his heroine to be addicted during her time in the Army.

    OP:
    I like the idea of your heroine being a nurse. I feel like they get less attention than doctors in pop culture and it would be refreshing to read about a nurse for a change. I don't know how things are in the US, but over here nurses are paid far less than they deserve considering the crazy hours and responsibilities they have. I'm not sure, but could an oppressive, "unfair" situation like that affect her drug abuse? Having to stay up through the night, perhaps in some less glamorous place like the free clinic. I've been to a hospital at night way too many times, and the nurses have carried out most of the procedures; the doctor checks you, gives the diagnosis (as is their job), and then the nurse usually takes it from there. I was thinking; if you wanted a more "action-y" job for your character, it might also work, a lot of chances for errors there. Come to think of it; free clinic doctors always look dead-tired too... And most of them are 1) immigrants 2) young doctors who've just started out. But like @jazzabel said, I'm sure you can do what you want with both.
    Personally I'd be more intrigued to read about a nurse just 'cause they seem to get less attention in literature, TV, etc.

    Breaks my heart you guys have to fight 'cause I really like you both :(
     
  2. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    i'm seeing one person being polite in her responses to discourteous personal attacks and the attacker being rude and insulting to the point of what i would consider calling for censure, if i were a mod...

    sadly, no mod has seen fit to do so and the op's thread has been turned into a venue for one member to ceaselessly attack another in a manner that is not supposed to be allowed here...

    my condolences to both the op and the attackee...
     
    jazzabel likes this.
  3. minstrel

    minstrel Leader of the Insquirrelgency Supporter Contributor

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    Okay, gang, I've deleted a bunch of posts in here because they're just Ginger and Jazz fighting.

    Ginger and Jazz, please stop fighting. And don't take it to PM. We've all gone through this before. If I see any more posts that are nothing more than the two of you punching each other, I'll delete them too.

    You've both been valuable contributors to the forum. Please continue to be, and drop this feud. It doesn't matter any more who's right and who's wrong; the fight itself is harming the forum.
     
  4. Jack Asher

    Jack Asher Banned Contributor

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  5. jazzabel

    jazzabel Agent Provocateur Contributor

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    That's very interesting @Jack Asher, thank you for sharing the link. I only know what my friends who were military medics tell me, but they might've been more paranoid, or subjected to closer scrutiny? Or maybe they were just being naive. I can see how anabolic steroids might not get 'caught' it all depends on what you are testing for as well as military being quietly tolerant of it for reasons known to them.

    The article talks a lot about smuggling illegal substances, which doesn't surprise me since the conditions of their movement across borders are much more lax then for the civilians. I have a friend who is ex SAS and he tells me that as long as you're on the job, nobody will so much as look at you, let alone search you or put you, or your plane, or your luggage through any kind of scrutiny. It's a don't ask don't tell carte blanche, it's just how it is. Get a bad apple in the wrong place and you get a disaster.

    Every system can be abused, and I remember Howard Marks, a guy famous for his unapologetic cannabis smuggling that went on for decades, talking about how easy it was to smuggle tons of cannabis through various security channels such as CIA, MI6, IRA etc. It just goes to show that anything is possible, the writer, or a criminal, just has to find a way to make it work :D
     
  6. KaTrian

    KaTrian A foolish little beast. Contributor

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    I'm wondering, would it actually be easier for a medic to be a junkie in the Army in comparison to, say, your regular grunts? Though drugs and exercise don't really mesh, unless we're talking about steroids. Working out while high on opiates or mj sucks, and if you're a deployed medic, I wonder how physically demanding that is and whether it is possible to maintain a habit and function as expected.

    Though we don't want this forum to turn into a police state like some other forums, do we? :p Free speech and all that, more responsibility on the members, and little by little we'll learn. Still, thanks @minstrel for stepping in, it was getting out of hand...
     
  7. Fitzroy Zeph

    Fitzroy Zeph Contributor Contributor

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    Alesia, I know an ER doc, here's what I think.

    Docs can go through a wide variety of rotations in their training in many countries. My friend wanted heavy trauma experience so he went to Jo-berg, stab wounds and gun shots galore, and to Denver, one of highest guns shots per capita states.

    I think both docs and nurses have the same chances of hiding addictions. Nurses are subordinate to doctors, so I'm not sure why gaining access to the medicine chest would be easier. ER rooms have acutely sick people and the doctors are in the muck digging, so can make as many mistakes as nurses. Many great doctor characters exist in books that are out there.

    The bigger they are, the harder they fall.

    A nurse who was romantically involved with a slightly psycho doctor, perhaps the first to write her a script for Oxy after her last detox session to gain a little, nudge nudge, wink wink, favour.
     
  8. GingerCoffee

    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    Technically the nurse in an ED is an employee of the hospital, not an employee of the physician.

    While a staff nurse (not talking about an advanced practice nurse here) is not going to make medical decisions (beyond a decision to follow a standing order), an RN has not only a right, but an obligation to question an order or refuse to carry it out if the nurse believes the order to be dangerous to the patient. There is no malpractice excuse for an RN that administers a medication which was erroneously written. The nurse is required to know the drugs and treatments they are administering.

    In addition, physicians can be subordinate to some clinical nursing positions. Infection control and employee health, for example, can require a physician comply with their respective policies.
     
  9. Fitzroy Zeph

    Fitzroy Zeph Contributor Contributor

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    Ginger,

    So it sounds like Alesia can go a couple ways with her MC. I personally like the doctor idea, even if it presents more of a writing problem for her. In real life, there are doctor substance abusers and nurse substance abuser. Likely more nurses though.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2013
  10. Alesia

    Alesia Pen names: AJ Connor, Carey Connolly Contributor

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    @KaTrian I don't think she would have maintained a really bad habit while deployed. The way I envision it is the worst of it started when she got back stateside, if I choose to go that route.

    Personally, I tend to agree with some of the others that RN is definitely a better route to go. Unfortunately with shows like ER, House, Grey's Anatomy, and so on floating around, the whole idea of the primary protagonist being a "bad" doctor who can handle their personal problems while still saving lives has gotten a bit cliche'. Aside from Nurse Jackie, I don't know of any other works, written or film that depict things from the nurses POV.
     
  11. GingerCoffee

    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    I've not checked the stats on the per/capita rates, but in absolute numbers, it makes sense there are more nurse substance abusers because there are many more nurses than physicians.

    BTW, Alesia is a he. ;)

    This^ is the best reason in the world to write from the POV of a nurse.
     
  12. Simpson17866

    Simpson17866 Contributor Contributor

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    Then maybe focus on the "addict" more than on the "functional"? Even if her POV tells that she is keeping it "under control," show the fact that more patients are getting hurt on her watch than on most other people's?
     
  13. Fitzroy Zeph

    Fitzroy Zeph Contributor Contributor

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    Oops, sorry about that. Thanks for the heads up.
     
  14. Alesia

    Alesia Pen names: AJ Connor, Carey Connolly Contributor

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    Yeah, people get confused alot on that lol. My username stems from my MC's name, Alésia Connor.
     
  15. Alesia

    Alesia Pen names: AJ Connor, Carey Connolly Contributor

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    Another scenario I found while searching the web for something else: What if my "nurse" isn't actually a nurse? Not in the sense of being a hospital employee anyway. (Medical assistant in a private practice may work here as well.) Apparently some law enforcement agencies send medically trained officers into hospitals and Dr's offices on prescription drug, sexual harassment, and various other offenses stings. In the timeline this would give her enough time to spend one or two years in the military, come home and complete the police academy and move on with the story as planned. Also, this fits with her father being a detective for the LAPD and her brother being a beat cop as well as having several other family members in the DEA, LAPD, FBI, and so on (read law enforcement family.)
     
  16. GingerCoffee

    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    I've never heard of such sting operations. Where did you find it?

    Hospitals take care of drug diversion internally. I can't see that the failure of the system would be so great as to warrant sting operations.
     
  17. Alesia

    Alesia Pen names: AJ Connor, Carey Connolly Contributor

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    Most stings I'm reading about seem to deal with doctor/patient sex crimes and potential terrorist activity being used in the medical field.

    http://www.ksbw.com/news/central-california/monterey/monterey-doctor-arrested-in-undercover-prescription-drug-sting/-/5738820/21786230/-/1fjfbwz/-/index.html

    Here is one where the undercover was patient, but the principal remains basically the same: a police sting on a doctor for selling prescriptions illegally.
     
  18. GingerCoffee

    GingerCoffee Web Surfer Girl Contributor

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    OK, here's the key to that:
    All of our narcotic prescriptions are monitored. Prescribers can be flagged for excessive prescriptions.

    The only way a nurse would be flagged is as a dealer on the street. If he's just diverting for self use, and not prescribing, it wouldn't come to the attention of the authorities. The exception being that addict that infected a cluster of people with hep C. Hep B, C and HIV are reportable diseases. Public health investigates clusters. That's how he was found.
     

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