None of that makes sense to me. Not only is the villain someone that turns into a psychopath as a result of relatively minor social frustration, but the villain assumes that a cop, a cop, will also turn into a psychopath due to that cop's own relatively minor social frustration? He abruptly decides to trust the cop and invite him into his villainous clubhouse? Again, why do you need this plot element? To justify why the cop is chasing a criminal? Obviously, cops chase criminals. So why do you need it?
I may have lost something in the melee, the character in question is currently a cop when the near-rape occurs? Because yeah it'd make no sense for the villain to reach out to a cop in any capacity about his crime, whether as a cohort or just to be like "look what I did for us" (unless this is some kinda bragging Ripper character which does not seem to be the case). Well, unless this story is also about police corruption.
Okay thanks, so you think that is makes more sense for him to be okay with the kidnapping and fearmongering but not okay with rape later? And yes the villain is the leader who talked him into it, and he was the follower type. But it was pointed out before that if he is not broken, then the kidnapping doesn't make sense. But I cannot have him be broken, if he is turn on the villain and stop him later, right? The reason why the villain wants to team up with a cop, is because he knows the cops are onto him for past kidnappings and fearmongerings. They don't know who he is, just that a mystery kidnapper is on the loose. So he recruits a cop because not only does he think he has a similar past to the cop, but he thinks that having a cop on his side would make a good informer for him to have in the police station when it comes to the investigation.
As I understand the outline, a good idea is the one where she's kidnapped, but good guy doesn't think about rape; they just want to teach a lesson in respect. Then, bad guy says "rape her" and he struggles with her but this goes on for only two minutes because she is fighting him. And he backs off that night, but is haunted that he came that close to it. Sorry if slow. On phone.
The reason why the villain wants to team up with a cop, is because he knows the cops are onto him for past kidnappings and fearmongerings. They don't know who he is, just that a mystery kidnapper is on the loose. So he recruits a cop because not only does he think he has a similar past to the cop, but he thinks that having a cop on his side could make a good mole for him to have in the police department when it comes to the investigation.
Like, I can more easily see a person who's really disenchanted with a world he perceives to've done him wrong falling in with a genuine sociopath who goes "hey man, let's kidnap this chick who was mean to us and scare her" and he sees this person as being the only one who understand him and he does have this long-boiling anger at people in general so he goes along with it. But when confronted with the prospect of actual rape he backs down. Because if he doesn't, his character goes from just being pissed off and misled to genuinely mentally disturbed, and then he's not going to feel guilty about it later / he's going to be so devoted tot he other villain from this act that there'll be no turning on him. As to whether someone can be capable of kidnapping and purposeful mental (and non-sexual physical?) abuse but not rape, I mean, suppose that's up for debate. Not a professional. But I think it is. People are complicated. I'm gonna be honest, that does not make sense to me, but I'm also very tired so I'm gonna exit the thread. Frankly I'm finding your plot difficult to follow/understand in general.
Hmm. Hmm. "We'll kidnap her and scare her into not being so mean to us!" The child pulling wings off flies. The underdeveloped personality. Children. Adolescence. That's the vibe I get. OK. Joe, to give the future cop a name, was bullied in school, and he had a friend, Howard, who was bullied, too. In a horrible, drug and alcohol fueled incident during their sophomore year of high school, they kidnapped a girl. Stuff happened. In fact, I think the girl died. Nobody ever found out who did it. Joe always blamed Howard for being the instigator, but he was an active participant. That was fifteen years ago. Things have happened to Joe. He got a decent set of foster parents. He was arrested for some other crime and ordered into court-ordered counseling. He joined AA and NA. Fifteen years, he's been working on himself, pasting over what's broken, trying to become a real person. He's an undercover cop. On some occasion, he recognize the villain, and he realizes the villain is Howard. This is his chance to make up for what he did when he was fourteen. I feel that I can believe that. The difference is the adolescent start, the drugs, and the fifteen years, instead of fifteen minutes, to make a transformation. Maybe.
Okay thanks. What about is the villain wanting to work with a crooked cop and use him as a mole does not make sense? It's a common plot device for thrillers, for the villain to have a mole in the police deparment, and the reason is, is that moles can be useful for when the cops are onto you. What doesn't make sense about it in this case?
For one thing, the cop actively participating in crimes. But I'm done. I feel that you're set on an implausible concept, and you're never going to step away from it. I'm wasting my typing fingers.
I thought that in order to recruit the cop he would have to at least participate in one crime as a sign if some trust. that's what this is for. the villain is testing him for it.
I don't follow everything on this thread, but there are crooked cops. Sometimes more crooked than a dog's hind leg.
He's not looking so much to create blackmail, but more of a partnership though. Blackmailing the cop, would just be a headache, but he still has to get the cop to participate in the crime for the partnership to have trust, no?
I'm going to make what I hope is my very last post in this thread. This subplot seems to be coming down to a character's belief that committing rape is a heroic act performed for the good of society. And the idea that we're supposed to be sympathetic to that belief. No, we're not supposed to agree, I assume, but we're supposed to find it understandable enough to not wholly condemn this character. And that's... That's... My head explodes. Yes, sure, characters do bad things. And sometimes characters think they have a good reason for doing bad things. But if it's necessary to go down the twisted, twisted path of a character who comes up with a deluded justification for why the bad things that he does are really heroic acts of service, why does that twisted plot have to be yet another rape plot? Why is rape the only thing that people can come up with? Why isn't he torturing toddlers? Why isn't he beating up senior citizens? Why is rape the crime that we, apparently, are thought to be willing to excuse? And why is the victim so utterly irrelevant to the plot? The plot is about the person committing the rape, and the villain that he's trying to capture, and yet again, as with so many of these rape plots, the actual victim of the rape is a complete, total, non-entity. We're supposed to be consumed with sympathy about the characters' failure to make friends, to have a spouse, to have a good job. We're talking about his motivation, his history, poor baby, poor thing. But the rape victim? She apparently doesn't matter. Her background, her motivation, the impact of all of this on her, hasn't been discussed in this thread, not one word. She doesn't matter. She's a plot device. She's a vessel to define the feelings and motivations of the other characters; she doesn't actually exist as a character. Ryan, please Google "rape as a plot device". Please consider finding something more creative. I'm now done discussing this plot. The issue of why rape is such a quick-and-easy ready-made plot, why it's used so often in plots where the victim doesn't matter even a tiny little bit, is a possible topic of discussion, but I seem to remember that there's a thread somewhere on the forum where that was already discussed.
Okay thanks. However, I did not mean to imply that the victim does not matter. She is actually the second main character and a much more main character than this current character we are talking about. She has a lot more time in the story, and she effects more of it. I did mean to imply that she does not matter to the story at all. I don't necessarily need rape to be the device that drives the plot per say. But I do need her to be kidnapped as part of the villains revenge plan, and I thought rape would be a sensible motivation as to why she is kidnapped and held somewhere for a large amount of time. He doesn't necessarily need rape to be the plot device, that he uses as part of his act of striking back, but whatever plan it is, it does need to have this kidnapped female character. Also I was not aware that rape is so often used as a plot device. Perhaps I haven't read a lot of stories or watched a lot of movies where it is. Thank you for pointing it out.
