Giving up genre...

Discussion in 'Genre Discussions' started by deadrats, Mar 6, 2019.

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  1. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    That doesn't really work. Creations build on other creations. The first person who ever made anything like music might have clapped their hands or stomped their feet in a pleasing manner. It might still be a pleasing manner. But that doesn't mean they'd get a recording contract today. Millenia of musical tradition, creation of instruments, etc., etc., exist, and the competition is building on them.

    I don't really care if you want to read. If you don't want to BE read, or be published, you don't need to care either--you can do the equivalent of clapping your hands and stomping your feet in a pleasing manner. But if you do want those things, it seems not all that likely that you will achieve them without either reading or some substantial substitute for reading. For example, the audiobook idea is interesting--it might be a sufficient substitute. I don't know.
     
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  2. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    Someone must have clapped their hands in a pleasing manner first, before anyone else did.

    I do read a bit just not novels. I read blogs on writing. Articles on writing.

    Would be an interesting experiment though. To see if I could get published without being a reader at present. I just don't understand why people think you HAVE to do one to do the other. Stories are everywhere, not just in the written word.
     
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  3. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    I've learned more from studying non-fiction books on the art than I have from reading a novel. I just found I couldn't appreciate certain things until I knew to look for them and know when they were being used correctly.

    Audio book I did. But I get bored sitting still that long and if I listen in bed I can't sleep afterwards. Sometimes I play them in the background when I'm cleaning. My dog likes hearing them.
     
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  4. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    People on this site may accept and not judge me but others have.
    I've mentioned it on other forums and it once sparked a three day debate. Poor girl only wanted to know what everyone was reading haha. It ended like the opening scene of Saving Private Ryan. A moderator had to wade in a close the thread. I caused like a mutiny then ran away.
     
  5. XRD_author

    XRD_author Banned

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    Time spent reading is time spent not writing.
     
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  6. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

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    I read/listen to way more non-fiction than I do fantasy fiction. Want a truly creepy villain for your WIP, then read True Crime stories for inspiration. Nothing beats real life for story ideas.
     
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  7. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

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    Time spent writing poorly is time spent away from reading.
     
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  8. XRD_author

    XRD_author Banned

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    Well, I can. But I'm a very imaginative guy.
    Here's two off-the-top-of-my-head possible reasons it might be bad advice:
    1. It's an inefficient use of time compared to other activities (like giving and getting critiques)
    2. garbage in, garbage out => Read crap, write crap.
     
  9. John Calligan

    John Calligan Contributor Contributor

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    Obviously (to me) “read a lot” means “analytically read good books as much as you can stand.”
     
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  10. XRD_author

    XRD_author Banned

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    You did indeed miss something: I "tried that route" of reading to improve my writing by reading books that "Noted Authorities" said were "well written," and found that they weren't, to my eye.

    I never said I only read books like that. Sticking "only" in when someone else didn't even imply it is non-productive.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  11. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    So true! But then I love Psychology so I am fascinated by that stuff. I went through a stage of writing true crime stories.
    The Diane Downs case was pretty horrible. Also the Moors murders. I usually look to real criminals to help me structure my Villains.
     
  12. XRD_author

    XRD_author Banned

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    Agreed. For example, no book or documentary can convey how it really feels to walk the the sacred mountain Koyo-san in Japan, or the streets of old Jerusalem. The best source for authors is living life, not reading books.
     
  13. XRD_author

    XRD_author Banned

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    She did say he likes to watch movies.

    [Edit: fixed the gender of the pronoun; my apologies.]
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
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  14. XRD_author

    XRD_author Banned

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    Time spent writing poorly is the only way to learn to write well.
    Well, maybe not the only way. But the most common one, it seems.

    No one becomes an Olympic gymnast by just watching other gymnasts.
    They have to try, and fail, and try again.
     
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  15. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    True for me. I was writing about a writing who had just lost a parent and I just couldn't convey that emotion - never lost anyone that close to me. I tried to read a book my friend gave me but it just didn't work. So I decided if I didn't know I couldn't really write it accurately, an experienced writer might have been able to do it, but not me.
    Then my Dad died. I lived those emotions at a young age for the first time. Could definitely write that character then and feel confident about doing it. I learned grief is a funny thing. Not only is it different for everyone, but it doesn't always hit you at that exact moment. I carried on with my life like nothing had happened for six months. My Doctor called it "shock".
     
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  16. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    I'm a she or was last time I checked. It could be inverted though.
    Not like, dear, LOVE. hehe
     
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  17. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    Next time you get my gender wrong I'm hog tying you to a chair.
     
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  18. XRD_author

    XRD_author Banned

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    Promises, promises.
     
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  19. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    I knew you were going to say that!
    Sadistic little man...
     
  20. seira

    seira Member

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    Never been a big movie freak. What movies would you recommend to someone wanting to start watching them? I don't mind what Genre.
     
  21. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    There are so many that I love. But these spring to mind:
    The Shawshank Redemption

    Schindler's List

    Gone with the Wind (especially when my Dad had eaten beans!)

    All about Eve

    The Silence of the Lambs

    The sixth Sense

    Monty Python and the Holy Grail

    the matrix

    Shutter Island

    African Queen

    Nell

    Poltergeist

    The Hand that Rocks the Cradle
     
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  22. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Has music not advanced even a tiny bit from clapping hands?

    Has no one ever written before?

    It’s too late to be the first one to engage in any of the major arts.
     
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  23. The Dapper Hooligan

    The Dapper Hooligan (V) ( ;,,;) (v) Contributor

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    And it sucked. Pretty much everything sucked and stayed the same with people making the same dumb mistakes over and over again generation after generation until we figured out that we can pass on information and learn from others.
     
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  24. Iain Sparrow

    Iain Sparrow Banned Contributor

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    You've missed the point.
    For a writer, reading is training.
    As any good artist, a good writer must be keenly observant and imaginative. And of course you better learn the craft of writing. I don't need to have experienced what my characters experience, only observe them and write it down. I know very little about nuns circa 1792, or what a certain courtesan named Valerie might be like in real life. But I can imagine them just fine.


    “They most likely aren’t,” Valerie said, a little stung. “I don’t suppose there’s any magic left in this ol’ moth-eaten world. For a time I thought there was. D’you know, while I tarried with the good ladies on their mountaintop, I took an instant liking to one of their flock. A quiet, plump woman from Damascus. Sister Yasmina has a habit of reciting irritatingly sublime proverbs, but you’d like her. I had returned from a humiliating misadventure in Rome and was horribly depressed. I failed miserably and let everyone down. That night, after we’d all retired to our rooms, it was Sister Yasmina who came to console me with kind words and a bottle of spiced rum. With sunshine in our bellies we drank the night away, talked into the small hours about trivial things, giggled like schoolgirls we did. When at last she got up to leave, so I could sulk in peace, she said to me, ‘The dogs bark, but the caravan moves on.’ It’s true. We carry on.”
     
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  25. jannert

    jannert Retired Mod Supporter Contributor

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    You've brought up such a good point about audio books. That's a relatively new medium, but it's really taking off. Audio books allow people who have difficulty reading, or truly don't have the time to read, to still enjoy books. Many of us were lucky enough to have our parents read to us when we were children, and this re-creates our experience of listening to the written word (minus the illustrations, of course.)

    This has advantages over movies, if you want to become a writer, because conveying the story is still dependent on the written word alone. No actors. No scene sets, or background music. There are no moving pictures to watch, except the pictures the words themselves create in our minds.

    While I love using/reading italics for thoughts, etc, they don't translate well to a spoken format. It's not obvious, when the story is being read out loud, what is in italics and what isn't. So it's one of the things I'm planning to work on eliminating for my next novel. I want to make a book that will SOUND good and not be confusing.

    I have a nephew who is blind, but who loves stories. I also have a good friend (a fellow writer) who struggles to read because focusing her eyes for any amount of time gives her massive headaches. This is a new development for her. She used to be a voracious reader, but then acquired an auto-immune disorder that affected her eyes. Both of these people use audio books.

    My friend has an audio-reader (where a robot reads the story to her.) She's got used to that flattish robotic voice, and can now enjoy 'reading' stories again. Audio books and audio readers have opened the door for many people who would not otherwise be able to read. This is a good development, provided it doesn't eliminate the need for children to learn to read in the first place. I don't want to see us going back to the days where many people were illiterate.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
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