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  1. Veltman

    Veltman Active Member

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    How bad is my horror novel setting?

    Discussion in 'Setting Development' started by Veltman, Dec 10, 2018.

    So, since my main projects left me blocked and I haven't written a word this month yet, I was looking for something else to do. So I started thinking up a horror story to write. (it will be ashort story, but that might change).

    A recently hired chief architect goes to Northeast Indiana to oversee the renovation of an abandoned resort purchased by his company. The old owner tells him to not change or destroy the east wing, and that it would be best to keep it sealed, as the paranormal events there and the history of some gruesome deaths have driven away the guests leading the Resort closing down. The owners of the company ultimately decide to expand the east and west wings to aim for a five star rating and increased profitability. Then things start to go wrong. Workers start becoming disturbed by the hauntings, suffering accidents dying and killing each other. Logistical problems and natural accidents (help me out here, snow, avalanches, hurricanes?) and delays cause the architect to start losing it after his job becomes at risk. I haven't thought out everything else.

    How bad and cliched is it? Is this worth writing?
     
  2. Edward M. Grant

    Edward M. Grant Contributor Contributor

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    That all depends on how you write it. People are still making horror movies about teenagers spending a weekend in a cabin in the woods where they're attacked by monsters, and many are cliched and bad while others are actually worth watching. There aren't so many about haunted hotels, but obviously this one does have hints of The Shining about it.

    What I would say is that as soon as I hear of workers dying or being badly injured, I think 'Health and Safety'. A realistic present-day story where they have to deal with that kind of thing could be quite interesting. Maybe the Occult Health and Safety team have to be called in to deal with the paranormal hazards :).
     
  3. Stormsong07

    Stormsong07 Contributor Contributor

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    Sounds a lot like The Shining. You'd have to really make sure you put your own spin on it to make it unique.
     
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  4. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    It isn't bad, and I agree with @Stormsong07 , that you
    should put your own spin on it. :)
     
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  5. Matt E

    Matt E Ruler of the planet Omicron Persei 8 Contributor

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    The Shining was more one family though, right? Having it based around workers on a construction site seems to be a cool approach. One thing: I'd doubt the company would initially want to leave the haunted wing alone. They'd want to tear that down first. But the previous owner or a local might warn about it. I'd expect the new owners to go full-on avatar and just want to remake the place.
     
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  6. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    I'm not a fan of the owner telling them that the east wing is paranormal--that hands the reader all the mystery, all solved, in one bundle.

    If this were my story, the owner AND his immediate heir would die unexpectedly, maybe in a car accident. The owner taught his heir to protect the east wing, but the heir didn't have time to teach HIS heir, who's probably just a child. So the owner's precautions are destoryed.

    So it's sold, or managed by non-family because an eight year old can't manage a resort, and whoever's managing it shrugs and starts remodeling the inexplicably neglected wing. That way you can slowly reveal the creepy parts. If you have your heart set on someone giving early warnings, it could be a retired employee.
     
  7. LadyErica

    LadyErica Active Member

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    Well, put it this way: A lot of my friends absolutely love the series "The haunting of Hill House" on Netflix. I've only seen a few episodes, but even I thought it was decent. And I'm a huge fan of horror. If the title didn't give it away, we're talking a haunted mansion on a hill. Hardly the most original story ever told. It's even based on a book, and have been turned into a movie twice, plus a stage play. And again, even I thought it was okay, from what I've seen.

    The point is, it's not really possible to make fully original or unique stories anymore. Everything has already been told. Dire warnings not to open or change the East Wing? Paranormal events? ZZZZzz.... what else is new?

    That said, the setting doesn't really matter to me. What matters is what you do about it. For one, I think it would be a good idea if the MC laughs at the warning, and compare it to a cheesy horror movie. This will let the reader know you are fully aware how bad the setting sounds. Of course they shouldn't change the East Wing. Ghosts are to be expected. So they open it anyway, and what'ya know. Ghosts happen.

    Or does it? Now that's the question. I do think bad things need to happen, but what's causing it? If I were to write the story, I would have plenty of explanations in mind. Ghosts is one thing. But there are tons of others. Maybe the old guy who warned them is behind it? Maybe someone from a rival company is behind it? Could it be spirits? Not ghosts, but forest spirits etc? Could it be simple accidents? Could it be a combination of several things, like both ghosts and someone sabotaging things? Could someone from his own company be sabotaging stuff, for insurance or whatever? What if the MC is the one doing the sabotaging? He's helping out with the investigations, yes, but that doesn't mean he can't be behind it. He could help out with the investigations, so he can give them false clues and lead them in the wrong direction, perhaps.

    In other words, the setting is a cliché, but that doesn't mean the story is. If you let the story be self-aware and know it's a cliché, you can easily throw off the reader's expectations, and build a real mystery here. Even if you do a full circle and come back to ghosts as the explanation, it doesn't matter, as long as you've managed to keep the reader guessing until then.
     
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  8. Veltman

    Veltman Active Member

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    @ChickenFreak you mean a theme where the misterious/paranormal force was contained but unlikely events means it gets out of control? Did I get it?

    @LadyErica My idea is to make not only the MC, but the reader as well question if anything paranormal is really going on and never really making that clear. I don't want to give a definitive answer. Maybe MC is losing it, making bad decisions, unlikely coincidences, maybe the ghosts are just hallucinations, I want his descent to be full of doubts and mistakes, but I don't know if he should just lose it completely or manage to solve the mystery and save the day by the end. What do you think? Too cliché as well?
     
  9. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Yep. Well, I don't know if I'd use the word 'theme', but that's just pedantry on my part. Your description is accurate.
     
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  10. Kalisto

    Kalisto Senior Member

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    I think the worse question to ask is how cliched is it? Who cares? The real question should be how interesting or uninteresting is it? I love ghost stories, but the best of the best always seems to be about something beyond ghosts. The best are very often meditations on the human experience. And this is because ghosts can represent so many different things. In literature, they very often become a personified raw emotion. They can represent longing, regret, love, hate, suffering, vengeance. Anything really.

    Some of the worst ghost stories I've ever read or seen was where the author seemed to believe that the purpose of the story is to put in as much "scary stuff" in there as possible.

    Those that are the best at least in some way attempt to explore some aspect of the human experience.
     
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  11. LadyErica

    LadyErica Active Member

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    It depends a lot on what kind of book you want to write. Have you read anything by Yrsa Sigurdarsdottir? The first book I read from her was in many ways a typical ghost story, and I thought it was quite brilliant. Not only were the paranormal stuff relatively believeable, but she even found a nice twist to end the story.

    However, in of the later books I've read, she kept building up all the paranormal stuff, but it went nowhere. For instance, the MC saw a small tennis ball or something laying in the snow outside a locked, supposedly haunted garage. A little while later, she saw the same ball in the window in the garage. The door was still locked, and there were no marks in the snow. So how did the ball go from outside the locked garage, to the window inside it? It was a creepy scene, but she never cared to explain that at all. Even worse, she had done that quite a bit. In the end, it all came down to a very human killer. That's it. All the ghost stuff was entirely pointless, and quite disappointing.

    Don't get me wrong, I do like the ghost stuff, and the paranormal bits. But I think if you have it in your story, the most important thing to do is let the reader know why it's there. If you have the ball moving on its own from outside a locked garage to the window inside, explain to the reader how it happened. Maybe there were two balls, and the one outside was covered in snow, making it look like it had moved. Maybe it did move, but it was the killer playing a trick on the MC, to make her question her sanity.

    In the end, that's really all that matters to me. Ghosts or not, I need a satisfying conclusion, without too many loose ends... though some are fine. Even if you go with a very human killer, there can still be hints that he or she wasn't behind everything. In fact, it remindsd of a story with Donald Duck, of all things. He, Scrooge and the nephews went to a lumberjack camp somewhere, where the workers had fled in terror. First of all, these were big, strong lumberjacks. What could possibly make them all run away in fear? But the problem was, they all blamed an angry forest spirit, or wind spirit. By the end of the story, it turned out it was a competitor causing all the accidents, and he and his guys made a fake spirit appear, to scare everyone. Done and done, right?

    Well... when they went to investigate, they found the bad guy and his guys all knocked out, and the fake spirit was unused. But if the fake one was unused, what was the spirit they did see? What really happened to the bad guys? Guess we'll never know... ;) And just like that, there was a natural explanation for almost everything... but not all. Maybe the spirit they saw was a trick on their eyes, or a real one? Could it have been something else entirely? Maybe the bad guys did use the fake one after all, but it was removed when they got knocked out? And knocked out by who? Or what?

    Again, the point is we got a pretty nice conclusion to the story, and almost everything was explained. What Sigurdarsdottir does in too many of her books is building up a lot of paranormal mysteries, then she just leaves them unresolved. That's pretty disappointing. They got the killer, yes. They found the motive, yes. But all the paranormal stuff was just forgotten all of a sudden? So why have it there in the first place?

    (sorry, I really need to stop writing these ginormous posts!) :oops:
     
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  12. Veltman

    Veltman Active Member

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    But if you give all the answers, isn't that underwhelming? Didn't Lovecraft himself say it's better not to wrap up everything?
     
  13. Maggie May

    Maggie May Active Member

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    You need to watch: My Haunted House. Ghosts mess with a lot of things, especially electrical. They can turn water on, they can throw things across the room and they can push people. So, they go in and start working on the electrical because it is so old. Is it ghosts or is it the bad electrical system that is causing people to be jolted. Same thing with old plumbing, is it ghosts or is it the plumbing that starts the water leaking out of the faucet. The water turns a color is it the pipes or the ghost. My grandfather would snore so loudly that the rocking chair in the room above him would move. When you have a logical explanation for most of the events the situations you don't have an explanation for is what can be scary.
     
  14. exweedfarmer

    exweedfarmer Banned Contributor

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    Yeah I agree. The Shining and Rose Red spring to mind.
     
  15. JDBrooks

    JDBrooks New Member

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    Another method of releasing the backstory of the forbidden wing of the building could be revealed in the form of manuscripts found hidden, that explain the backstory and the evil.
     
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  16. matwoolf

    matwoolf Banned Contributor

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    @ChickenFreak was on the money. Don't clue the 'by the way the east wing is haunted.' Leave the ends till the end.

    It's got me thinking to write a construction project with the spring arrival of an up-beat crew of builders and their gradual deterioration through the winter mystery, mystery, paranormal mystery.

    And the architect wouldn't deem to talk to the workers - that was my experience - he'd liaise with the site manager and be away solo on the horizon with his wheely walker and shiny hard hat.

    'Look at that prick...'

    'How much d'you think he's on?'

    spit

    I don't think he'd be the hero...maybe the villain?
     
  17. LoaDyron

    LoaDyron Contributor Contributor

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    A paranormal story is always interesting. I would suggest you do it more psychological rather violent. While in the story the murders can be gruesome, don't focus on that. Make your characters going through crazy stuff, make the having twisted illusions. Don't make the ghosts an easy enemy, after all. Your characters are dealing with something they can't fight easily. Maybe your spirit possess their victims and then kill them? Make your story a mystery. I hope this helps and have fun :)
     
  18. AbnormalThought

    AbnormalThought New Member

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    I would read that book...You should go for it...
     
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  19. cosmic lights

    cosmic lights Contributor Contributor

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    Is it worth writing? In my opinion, yes. Everything you write is gaining you experience and writing short stories is a good exercise that can teach you a lot. It's also worth writing something out of your comfort zone, or something that you've never tried (if Horror is your zone try a romance or a sci-fi). Never just write because you see it being 'worth it' by that meaning this writing could take you somewhere if publishing is what you're looking at. Your premise sounds a bit long for a short-story though.

    Is it cliche? Most genres have tropes that make them that genre. So jazz it up a bit. Turn the tropes on their heads. If you're writing about demonic possession of a innocent girl, write is from the demons point of view. What you have so far is not something I would read because nothing jumps out at me. There's no hook that seems fresh too me. But as a fun exercise I don't see why it not appealing to anyone else matters. Write it. Edit it. Then maybe post it here for some feedback, part of learning is learning from your own mistakes.

    All the best
     
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  20. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    You can't tell how good or bad it is until you start writing it.. because both depend on your talent behind the keyboard. That said if you are 'blocked' on many projects already starting yet another one isn't the solution... that is just a recipe for a hard drive full of incomplete work
     
  21. J. J. Wilding

    J. J. Wilding Member

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    This is the kind of premise that has me booking to see a horror film at the cinema. If your writing style can forward the story along nicely without becoming boring I think this could be a fine story. As I've said in other posts, fully realised characters are the driving force behind any kind of writing, especially horror. If you have those the story will come naturally and flow from page to page seemlessly, much like Dracula does. From the description it's a story I want to read so stick with it!
     
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  22. John Calligan

    John Calligan Contributor Contributor

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    Your story does sound good. I just wanted to point out that sometimes in horror, mystery isn't that big of a deal. Sometimes the stories try to give you the satisfaction of watching someone ignore good advice and suffer. "Don't cross the bridge, because that's where the headless horseman lives." "Screw you old man, we are going swimming!"
     
  23. Nykeloc

    Nykeloc New Member

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    I thought of The Shining as soon as I read the plot but you could have enough unique twists to keep it from being cliched just as the the haunting of hill house did.
     
  24. Darius Marley

    Darius Marley Member

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    The concept is a tad derivative, as some have already pointed out. Maybe you could simply change the setting from a hotel... to a hospital? A private high-profile maternity hospital under partial construction. And the MC is a soon-to-be father. Wife has been in labor way too long. Bored, he starts wandering around. Lots of uber-creepy potential there.

    Sorry. Not trying to write it for you, but I do love horror. I really hope you get inspired and knock this one out of the park!
     
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  25. JDBrooks

    JDBrooks New Member

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    Well hell, now you've got ME wanting to write that story! :D
     
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