Is proper grammar everything?

Discussion in 'Word Mechanics' started by MatrixGravity, May 30, 2011.

  1. Steerpike

    Steerpike Felis amatus Contributor

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    The job of the writer is to communicate with a reader. That communication may be informative, entertaining, or may serve any combination of purposes. It is the character and effectiveness of the communication that is of paramount importance - more important than adherence to any given rule of grammar.

    Popsicledeath already dealt with the chicken and egg issue of grammar as descriptive of how people use language versus grammar as prescriptive for people's use of language. It is a bit of both, of course, but over time the descriptive angle wins out.

    When it comes to grammar in artistic writing particularly, my primary concern is whether the author is effective and achieves her objectives. When it comes to a writer like Cormac McCarthy, also mentioned above, the author's prose is highly effective. To object to it based on the lack of some punctuation mark or other is foolish, because the essential function of punctuation in written language is to provide clarity to the reader of the written word. If a work, like The Road, achieves this without certain punctuation (and I argue that McCarthy does) then rejecting the author's otherwise-effective writing over a lack of formal punctuation is like rejecting a high-performance automobile because it doesn't have a fish tank. It is only lacking something it does not need.
     
  2. haribol

    haribol New Member

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    Grammar is indeed a nasty thing, and it nauseates me at times. Grammar is essential and we cannot just imagine writing ungrammatical sentences.I feel like vomiting if I come across ungrammatical sentences. Sentencing rightly demands of us a great amount of exercise.

    I often see mushrooming Asian writers and they are incapable of writing grammatically sensible articles. Taking just advantage of a huge readership in their countries, for instance India that boasts of numbering 100 million English speakers. English is their second language and they have learned it in the course of their studies in schools and colleges.

    The most stomach-turning thing I feel when I read their writings and hear their utterances is their improper use of prepositional phrases and definitive articles.

    These two aspects: use of appropriate prepositions and definitive articles are the real problems they are facing. They do their best but they never could master these things.
     
  3. Sundae

    Sundae New Member

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    The answer to this question is both YES and NO.

    Do I win a prize now?

    How about if I say that it is more yes than no.

    ?
     
  4. popsicledeath

    popsicledeath Banned

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    Then definitely no.

    !
     
  5. Gigi_GNR

    Gigi_GNR Guys, come on. WAFFLE-O. Contributor

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    Grammar, spelling and punctuation are the building blocks of a story. If your grammar or spelling or punctuation is awful, it can make even a good story bad. I've often seen run-on paragraphs that were so drastically improved by punctuation that it was difficult to believe it was the same paragraph.
     
  6. art

    art Contributor Contributor

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    If you otherwise useless, grammar is pretty important.
    If your imagination is fertile; if your insights are acute; if you are properly funny then grammar becomes rather less important since somebody might be willing do all that nasty stuff for you. I recall Oscar Wilde's exhortations to his editor...
    As a general guide, you (we all) would do best to regard ourselves as otherwise useless.
     
  7. HorusEye

    HorusEye Contributor Contributor

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    Well, rolling down-hill is a form of driving...?
     
  8. digitig

    digitig Contributor Contributor

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    I think where you got into trouble when you identified the issue as clarity. I always say that the key issue is effectiveness, and whether something is effective depends on what you are trying to do. If it's just communication of facts, such as for an instruction manual, then clarity is right up there. But in creative writing communication of information isn't the be-all and end-all; there's a whole pile more we're trying to achieve, not least emotional engagement. It's that which stops the slide into lowest common denominator writing. But it's also why making up rules on it is so futile. Different writers have different objectives, different readers are looking for different things.
     
  9. Cogito

    Cogito Former Mod, Retired Supporter Contributor

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    A knowledge of proper grammar is essential, along witfh an understanding of why improper grammar can cause confusion. Certainly, few readers, or even editors, will grouse if you slip up some of the more esoteric grammar or punctuation rules. Moreover, there are times you can take liberties with flawed grammar, such as dialogue or character-driven barration.

    Even sentence fragments.

    But you should always know when you are using incorrect grammar, and understand its effects, both positive and negative.

    Words, punctuation, sentences and paragraphs are your tools and building materials. Master them, or become their slave. Your choice.
     
  10. popsicledeath

    popsicledeath Banned

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    How can a writer be effective if they aren't first clear?

    I like the ongoing lessons in the flaws of communication, though, in that our assumptions are often what lead to a breakdown of that communication.

    Assuming I mean write at a first grade level or take all 'creative' out of the writing for the sake of clarity is preposterous, and I don't understand, if not just to argue for the sake of arguing, why people keep making such assumptions just so they can then argue points I wasn't making.

    Clarity is king. If you aren't clear, then what hope have you of delivering complex, difficult or even confusing meanings? Yes, that's right, meanings that are complex and confusing required even an extra degree of clarity.

    You're right, different writers have different objectives, none of which get met if those writers can't find ways to be clear in what they're writing.
     

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