Is this a good Mary Sue Test?

Discussion in 'Character Development' started by Prettyinpnk, Apr 1, 2018.

  1. X Equestris

    X Equestris Contributor Contributor

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    Some people prefer the alliteration of Marty/Mary, and others prefer the rhyming of Gary/Mary.
     
  2. Steerpike

    Steerpike Felis amatus Contributor

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    Seems silly to me not to just use “Mary Sue” for all of them.
     
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  3. X Equestris

    X Equestris Contributor Contributor

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    Agreed. I use it for all of them.

    That said, reading a long running fanfic critique blog has shown me that male Sues tend to display their center of the universe status and world bending abilities differently than female ones. So I see why some people use different names.
     
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  4. Iain Aschendale

    Iain Aschendale Lying, dog-faced pony Marine Supporter Contributor

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    I may have read that one, don't remember exactly where I called a halt. I was a 17 year old babybat (we didn't call it that back then, but I love the concept ) when I was introduced to The Vampire Lestat, so that one will always have a special place in my heart.
     
  5. Wreybies

    Wreybies Thrice Retired Supporter Contributor

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    Funny, the connections we make. The Underworld films play and all I see is are a really long set of Evanescence videos. ;)
     
  6. Cave Troll

    Cave Troll It's Coffee O'clock everywhere. Contributor

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    Interesting. I found to be a kinda mashup of Blade and the Matrix.
    Oh, they should make a Blade/Matrix movie, that would be amaze-balls.:superagree:
     
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  7. Mckk

    Mckk Member Supporter Contributor

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    That's a shame. So Lee Child has pretty much tanked himself/his books because he couldn't say no to the first check. See, artistic integrity - he'd probably be making far more money now if he'd hold on to that, because he'd have signed himself up with a far better producer and cast Reacher properly.

    @Steerpike - I remember though there was one page - just that one page - I read once in maybe One Shot when Reacher put a paper boat onto water at night. I remember rereading that one page several times because it was gorgeous. That was the moment I realised Lee Child was writing to genre conventions and not to his full potential - the books don't show off his skill or artistry. He's just writing to make money and he's tailored his writing that way (which itself takes a certain level of skill). And I just remember thinking: what a shame.

    Like, it makes sense. I'm not criticising him - the man's gotta make a living and what I wouldn't give to make a career out of writing fiction. But still... bit of a shame.
     
  8. Steerpike

    Steerpike Felis amatus Contributor

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    @Mckk from what I’ve heard about why Child accepted the option from Cruise, i really wonder if he’d be making more money had he not gone that route. The guy already has more money from his books than he probably knows what to do with.

    Besides, I like the Reacher books. The movies I can do without.
     
  9. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    Or he might have signed up to some one who cast it properly but couldn't sell it and wound up going straight to the bargain bin. Tom cruise may not be 6,4 with a 50 inch chest but what he is is connected in Hollywood. Whether you like the casting or not the films gave Reacher an reach and brand recognition that he didn't have before, and that'll help Child sell a shit load of extra books.

    Also I did hear somewhere that he's writing a non Reacher book , featuring Francis Neagly as the MC (shes the girl who is reachers sidekick in Without fail and several others ) ... that won't be covered by his option so he'll be able to sell it elsewhere if he wants.

    EOTD I don't think any of us can really criticise his commercial sense given how much cash he's made from the books and film rights etc, whether we like it as fans or not. As I said if teeny tommy offered me those terms I'd snap his hand off
     
  10. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    All I see is Kate Beckinsdale in skintight leather ;)
     
  11. Wreybies

    Wreybies Thrice Retired Supporter Contributor

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    All I got was Scott Speedman, who's not a bad looking dude, but he lacks a certain viscerality for me to buy him as the sexy werewolf hybrid thingie he was playing. Kate, on the other hand, was a dead ringer for every little goth boy's slinky fantasy. :)
     
  12. Homer Potvin

    Homer Potvin A tombstone hand and a graveyard mind Staff Supporter Contributor

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    I'll take a buxom, chubby redhead with big lips and little hands in that role. Not that I've ever thought much about it.
     
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  13. CoyoteKing

    CoyoteKing Good Boi Contributor

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    That's a really cool insight.

    I'm really surprised to learn people consider Korra a Mary Sue. I won't lie, I kind of hated her in the first season of the show. Cocky, arrogant, never listens, but somehow everyone loves her.

    But over time -- as she grew and matured -- she really won my heart. I think the Avatar series is really about growing up, in a way. She's a little brash and over-confident, sure, but she's also strong and smart, and she genuinely wants to help people, even when she makes mistakes. She isn't perfect, but she tries. She's physically powerful, yet often weak and naive.

    And the romance aspect got me, I'll admit. I didn't expect [Korra and Asami] to end up together, but I'm glad they did.
     
  14. Mckk

    Mckk Member Supporter Contributor

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    I don't know - people say there's no such thing as bad publicity, but is that really true? Would be curious about how the films affected his sales. I guess deep down it's true that I'm just a pretty disappointed fan :( I remember discovering Killing Floor when I was a teenager, maybe 14 or 15, I dunno, and thinking OMG how cool would it be if this was a film? I'd totally watch it! I read all his books religiously for several more years before my inner critic got the better of me and I moved on to other books, but I was one of those who waited for his next book to come out and bought all his paperbacks (hardbacks were too expensive to be worth it). I owned like at least 9 of his books, maybe more.

    As I said, I'm not criticising him for accepting the check. I'm disappointed beyond words. As a legit fan. I even subscribed to his Reacher Creature forums at one point! I was a Reacher Creature!

    :cry::cry::cry::cry:
     
  15. TheRealStegblob

    TheRealStegblob Kill All Mages Contributor

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    Nah, I did try to give Avatar a chance but I couldn't get past how groan-inducing its attempts to be 'western anime' were for me. When I was younger (a kid when it first came on) I kind of blindly hated it, but when I grew up and gave it a less biased approach I found I still didn't like it despite the world building being pretty interesting. If it focused on being more of an action show and less on trying to do anime tropes, it probably would've been a great show. I straight up recall some "behind the scenes" commercial ad that would play for the show where one of the producers said something like "we're basically making an anime". Icky, no! Poopy ick! Didn't help that the show came out during a kind of decade-ish long timeframe where tons of """"""western anime"""""" shows were being produced.
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2018
  16. 123456789

    123456789 Contributor Contributor

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    That's pretty much exactly my expectation of a Mary Sue.
     
  17. TheRealStegblob

    TheRealStegblob Kill All Mages Contributor

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    From what I've come to understand, the answer is kind of "Yes and No". It depends on just how bad the bad publicity is. Harvey Weinstein or Bill Cosby were ruined by scandals and bad publicity, neither of them will ever recover from what's happened to them (which is rightfully so, given what they did and all). Donald Trump, for all his bluster about "being able to shoot someone and not lose poll numbers" saw his polls drop dramatically after the "grab her by the pussy" incident.

    Bad publicity isn't bad publicity when it helps your product reach more people's ears, but outright scandals can be terrible publicity (but not always) because people hate you instead of whatever you might be pushing. There will generally always be people who will buy what you're selling if they hear about it, because they don't care about hearing it from negative publicity. Some people will buy it because they saw it get a ton of bad press. The 2015 video game "Hatred" is probably the best example of a product that intentionally used bad publicity to its advantage. The game was purposely created to piss people off and get them angry (it's a rampage-style game where all you do is gun down innocent people) in order to generate publicity and drive sales, and once it sold hundreds of thousands of copies on its opening week, the developers publicly rejoiced at how easily video game journalists picked up their bait and ran with it.
     
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  18. Iain Aschendale

    Iain Aschendale Lying, dog-faced pony Marine Supporter Contributor

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    Dolph Lundgren
     
  19. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    except that dolph has the acting ability of a wardrobe
     
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  20. Homer Potvin

    Homer Potvin A tombstone hand and a graveyard mind Staff Supporter Contributor

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    He has something like a 180 IQ, I think... random but interesting.
     
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  21. 123456789

    123456789 Contributor Contributor

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    You can't have brains, brawn, AND acting.
     
  22. TheRealStegblob

    TheRealStegblob Kill All Mages Contributor

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    There's all sorts of crazy facts about the guy. When filming Rocky 4, Dolph punched Stallone so hard in the chest that Stallone had to go to the hospital, where the doctors thought he had gotten into a car accident judging my the severity of his injury. In 2009, some guys broke into Dolph's house and tied up his wife but once they realized they'd broken into Dolph's house they ran away.

    Guy's lived a pretty storied life.
     
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  23. CoyoteKing

    CoyoteKing Good Boi Contributor

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    Terrible but everyone loves her-- yeah. That's what I mean. That's the basic idea of a Mary Sue, and that's why I didn't like her in the very first season.

    The stuff about her being strong, but flawed and complicated -- I guess we're just going to have to disagree there. That's my basic expectation of a good character: having strengths and weaknesses. Changing and developing over time.
     
  24. Homer Potvin

    Homer Potvin A tombstone hand and a graveyard mind Staff Supporter Contributor

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    Heh, poor man's chuck norris.
     
  25. DapperDespot

    DapperDespot New Member

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    I think my input is that calling the answers correct or incorrect seems a bit heavy-handed. I don't know if the site you used has the option but maybe some kind of aggregation of points might come off as less harsh and you can have your input on individual questions at the end.
     

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