1. Some_Bloke

    Some_Bloke Active Member

    Oct 14, 2014
    Likes Received:
    Northern Ireland

    Issue with Lore

    Discussion in 'Setting Development' started by Some_Bloke, Jan 5, 2015.

    I've mentioned my side-project in another thread I think where essentially it's set in modern-day in a world where rather than hide from the eyes of mankind, fantasy and supernatural creatures and mankind have build their own society. There's a task force in the government/police that deal with crimes related to supernatural origins of magic.

    I've been creating this world's lore and I'm coming to the modern age. My original idea was to have mankind's pursuit of new technologies like gunpowder instead of magic drive the other species (Elves, Dwarves, Ravens ect) away from mankind and eventually go into hiding only to be rediscovered after world war two.

    My concern was that it seems kinda dumb especially with three of the species being more advanced and the alliance they shared in past wars. That and humanity wouldn't so easily forget about something that was such a big part of it's history, especially if it's the discovery of stuff like gunpowder that creates a divide.

    The other problem is that I'm establishing the Dwarves as the technologically advanced species. If so, they'd probably discover gunpowder before the humans.

    In short, the original idea has a lot of problems. My issue is that I don't have much of an alternative. All the inventions of the modern world exist (cars, guns, phones, WIFI ect) but in order for those things to exist a lot of events in human history have to happen (i.e no satellite communications if there isn't a space race/cold war).

    I need help with an alternative history that would still allow a lot of the events in human history to happen.
  2. Fan_Farming_Tastic

    Fan_Farming_Tastic New Member

    Dec 29, 2014
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    Could there have been some sort of devil's bargain? Like maybe the humans wanted to pursue these new technologies, but in order to do so they had to give up knowledge of the other cultures (dwarves, elves, etc.)? Or, since the humans are more "behind," perhaps the other cultures chose to use some of their own methods and technologies to obscure themselves from human awareness and involvement. It sounds like a fascinating idea!
  3. LorenaTralala

    LorenaTralala Member

    Jan 9, 2015
    Likes Received:
    Lawrence, KS
    Surprisingly your plot reminds me a lot of my own, except I went the completely opposite way, whereas you let your magical beings live in the open, i hid mine from the world. Your problem sounds like a problem a lot of 'alternative history' writers have, if it were me I'd think seriously about whether or not to make it a larger project because the plot is so complicated it seems to demand more of your time. Beyond that I'd like to know whose side you're telling this from because that would play a big part in the story telling. If it's from the humans side I'd tend to lean more toward historical accuracy with hints of the magical beings throughout. But if it's from the magical side you have more flexibility in that they're completely made up, you can use less historical accuracy because it's seen through fictional eyes, if that makes sense. Like instead of worrying so much about what makes sense historically you can create a different human story that only touches on main points in human history. Hopefully all of that made sense. What it comes down to though to me is that you need to step back from this project, a take a second look at your plot because it seems like to me you're drowning in the details which means you might need to look at what needs to change in the big picture. Just an opinion, hope it helps. :friend:Good luck!
  4. Nilfiry

    Nilfiry Senior Member

    Aug 4, 2008
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    Eternal Stream
    1. They went into hiding only from the general public with the government controlling the information of them. Think Men in Black.

    2. Depending on the relationship between the races, the more technologically advanced dwarves may simply have a superiority complex and chose not to share their discovery of gunpowder to humans until humanity discovered it on their own. Or it could be the other way around.
  5. !ndigo

    !ndigo Member

    May 26, 2014
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    Maybe the magic species saw the humans as too violent or power hungry and decided to shut themselves off with some sort of spell that causes the humans to stop believing in them.

    The dwarves could have had gun powder for ages and then the humans stole it and the theft is what helps to drive conflict.

    Another idea that I've seen a few places before is that technology and magic just don't mix. Magic is stifled by technology and vice versa. This would have driven the two sides apart rather rapidly. (Might not work with your dwarves though...)

    I think just about any situation involving a fair bit of magic and mistrust is plausible for separating the humans from the rest.

    Here are the things I'm curious about:

    Where did the magical races go? Were they hiding among the humans? In the forest/cave/underground or somewhere? Why weren't they discovered sooner? Did they have their own hidden continents that they retreated to and then shielded in magic? (think Atlantis)

    What caused them to come back together? Why would the magical races get back in contact with the humans after all that time apart? Were they running out of territory? Is there some curse that they need a human to help break? War? Did they run out of energy to keep the cloaking spell going?
    Some_Bloke likes this.
  6. qp83

    qp83 Member

    May 21, 2014
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    Well, looking at human history we see humanity bring war and sickness to every place we spread out to. So how about, these magical beings forsaw humanity's spread, and saw the danger if they came to possess magic, but also they wanted to keep magic for themself. So, as a solution they created an alternate world. Now, the "twist" here is that the reader would think they created an alternate world and moved themself into it, but actually they moved humanity into it. So we are living in a prison of sorts, disconnected from magic and the real world.

    Due to their side having magic, they also have a very peaceful society, which not everyone agrees on. What's the point of having magic, if you can't use it? Also, how much easier isn't it to steal from someone who doesn't have magical barriers around all their valuables. So there's plenty of motivation for some of their rotten apples to sneak into our 'prison' and steal and cause all sorts of mayhem that would keep your supernatural force occupied.
    !ndigo likes this.

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