Mental Health Support Thread (NOT for giving medical advice, or debating)

With the advancment of technology (both medical and otherwise), strong social policies and our ability to harvest produce at an industrial scale, 'negative genetic flaws' no longer play a part in our species' survival and pose no threat. Our use of chemicals has become far more of a threat to our physical survival than 'flaws' in our genetic make-up and we haven't yet been able to adapt.


Anyway, part of the problem with depression is losing interest in hobbies and things that you are/were passionate about. Yet one of the ways to help alleviate depression is to force yourself to continue with those passions and interests despite feeling unmotivated, until you re-ignite the joy it once brought, which will light the fire. At least that's what they say.

 

No need to look them up for my sake, I worked as a psychiatrist for a few years so I'm familiar. Quite a few antidepressants will cause erectile dysfunction and anorgasmia, certainly most SSRI's will, and all that improves once the treatment is withdrawn, provided that the mood disorder is in remission. Otherwise, depression itself will cause loss of libido in most people (like mania and hypomania will cause increase) so in a way, you are in the same situation. However, other improvements in mood, cognition and physical energy more than make it worth it for a lot of patients. However, there are some antidepressants that will cause a lot less problems in that arena, but they might have some other side-effects. Eventually, every patient finds one they can tolerate. Due to brain chemistry being so complex and intricately connected, no one neurotransmitter is responsible for any one thing, it's a system of positive and negative feedback, and this is why treatment and side-effect profile varies.

However, you discuss the issue of dependance or addiction. Antidepressants are neither because they enable supplementation of something that is missing, rather than introducing the substance which causes euphoria, thus introducing something which mimics effects of endogenous chemicals, thus up-regulating the receptors (increasing their number). For example, introducing certain pain medication, saturating and up-regulating opiate receptors, so when the drug is withdrawn, the body isn't capable of producing the excess needed to satisfy the newly increased need. It's a very different situation in all respects, which is why we don't talk about antidepressant withdrawal in terms of classic addiction or dependance.

But even if it was an addiction, if it saved lives, caused no damage or altered consciousness, what's the problem? You withdraw it slowly. Is it really such a big deal?

 

[MENTION=3956]captain kate[/MENTION]: SSRI's, as their name indicates, block re uptake (reabsorption) of existing serotonin, so that it hangs around for longer and does work for longer. By prolonging the normal reuptake rate, we artificially mimic adequate levels of the chemical which is depleted. Some people, indeed over 50% of depressed patients, can and do go back to being able to produce adequate amounts of the needed neurotransmitter.

Also serotonin and dopamine aren't the same thing, just like depression and bipolar illness aren't the same, and thus aren't treated in the same way, although there may be some medication crossover..

 

I know, I was just bored.

Just to make it clear: so anti-depressants never cause permanent side-effects (in and of themselves, I mean)? I haven't had any, but just have read about some who claim to have gotten permanent side-effects (like anorgasmia / numbness in some body parts) from anti-depressants. If it's impossible, I could just disregard those claims as bullshit.

I pray you're right. In my case, the ones that have worked even reasonably well (like quetiapine, amitriptyline, and diazepam), have had side-effects worse than the depression while others either haven't worked at all (SSRIs) or have just provided the side-effects without any notable benefits. The search continues...

No problem at all in my opinion, never said there was one (I just tend to question things a lot). But yeah, in my experience (and that of a few friends), it is a pretty big deal because the withdrawals can get so bad that you really do want to kill yourself, death starts to look like a relief. During the worst times, the only reason I haven't wrapped myself around a telephone pole is because I don't want to cause such grief to my family. Hence while I'm definitely not against anti-depressants, I'm cautious when it comes to any medication that needs to be taken daily and then withdrawn.

 

Perhaps I can fill in the blank here since I've actually taken (several) serotonin based anti-depressants. (I say serotonin based to mean that they act on the serotonin levels in some manner. This includes tricyclics, SSRIs and SNRIs.) Do these drugs cause anorgasmia? Some of them do. However, the effect will commonly clear within a week of full discontinuation.

Can the effect be permanent? Yes and no. As erectile dysfunction is also a side effect, some men find they can't "get it up" when taking some serotonin based anti-depressants. When they go off the drug though, they still have problems. Why? It's not a side effect of the drug, but the simple axiom "if you don't use it you lose it." There have been men who undergone voluntary chastity for long periods of time in chastity devices that prevent erection. (Talking year or more here) Then when they go to try and get an erection, they find they are unable to do so. Like any muscle (of which the penis is one) if it is not 'exercised' then it may not function properly when you go to use it.

So it is very possible if a guy was on SSRIs for a decade and never had sex in that time that he might have erectile dysfunction and/or anorgasmia. However, if that same guy was to go without sex for the same amount of time (without being on drugs) the same would likely happen. Therefore, I suggest this is an issue of long term anti-depressant use potentially causing a sexual dysfunction due to lack of sexual activity - and not because the drug has actually altered the body in some way to cause the issue. Does that make any sense?

Talk to your doctor about buproprion hcl (aka Wellbutrin in some countries). It's not serotonin based at all, instead primarily working on dopamine levels, with secondary impact to norepinephrine levels. Side effects are mild, there are no sexual side effects and the drug is generally well tolerated. The only risk is for those who are epileptic and/or have a high risk for seizures. The drug slightly lowers the seizure threshold, but we're talking fractions of a percentage here. Unprovoked seizure in the general population is on average 0.07 to 0.09%, on buproprion dosages at/below 300mg that rises to 0.1%, and dosages above 300mg it rises to 0.4%. So at reasonable levels the drug really doesn't have that much higher of a seizure risk than would happen spontaneously.

IMHO, the biggest risk with anti-depressants is not taking them and ending up dead because of suicide.

 

Uh...my doctor's the one that explained that dopamine plays a role in depression. The two combined play a role in bipolar. Somehow I'll believe the board certified psychiatrist on this one.

 

Sure captain kate, believe whatever you want. Or, you can look it up in any of thousands of references, all of which explain it quite clearly

 

Mental illness is a pretty tiresome subject for me. All of my immediate family members and many of my extended family members have suffered from either schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, schizoaffective disorder, depression, schizophrenia, or anxiety disorders. I have to say it's genetic. I'll also say that medication aren't the answer to every problem (though they help do more than half the battle in most cases). But above all I emphasize that you can't will yourself out of these situations. You can't just "pick yourself out of your bootstraps". Furthermore, people who actually decide to commit suicide aren't weak - if by weak you mean having a low tolerance for pain and hardship. My brother actually died to the mental illness and he had a full time job while graduating at the top of his class in college and suffering from schizophrenia. I'd wager that's pretty good. I had a former 'friend' tell me to kill myself while I told him I was suicidal. Actually, I consider my brother a better, more resillient person than I was. These things are not black and white.

I'm a bit skeptical of SSRIs, I have found that Sertraline in particular made me feel abysmally depressed. Prozac is alright, but I didn't get relieved of depression until I started taking testosterone shots, since my genetic disposition dictates that I have less than 1% of the normal testosterone levels. I think psychiatrists sometimes over-prescribe medication, but overall they are doing more good than harm by a long shot.

The point is, I feel some of you are mistaken about some aspects nature of mental illness, including the original poster. I urge you to get professional help, but I believe it is a grave mistake to do any writing while depressed. I certainly don't want to dash the one thing you enjoy while being depressed - God knows there's little enough of it while depressed - but in my experience, writing just made me feel worse. Inherently, writing involves rumination and contemplation, reconsidering and deliberation, hard work and sometimes rejection by people who think that your writing needs improvement - but owing to chemical imbalances in your brain, you consider this as a problem where people hate you for the things you're writing. If you enjoy writing, then by all means incorporate it into a schedule. It's just when I did it, I wrote frightening, horrible things. They weren't violent by any means to anyone but myself, but the writing became so polluted with depression that after I recovered I burned all the pages one at a time.

And mental illness doesn't confer any particular writing talent on those afflicted by it. I think anyone who believes this is an idiot. It makes your writing horrible, in most cases. I'm astonished that Virginia Woolf can write so well, and I read her work I'm continually baffled that she wrote so well. However, as she herself refuted this myth, I am more than willing to affirm the idiocy of anyone who falls into this extremely erroneous belief.

Here's to a speedy recovery, OP. I would also highly encourage exercise, it heals the brain like no other medicine. PM me if things get worse, I hope all goes well.

 

Big hugs - I know how hard it is. I have depression to and writing when you're sick is really hard. I don't have any advice, and anyway there's been a lot of advice given already. Keep trying, keep going forward.

 

I can understand what you're saying, although you can still write without actually putting your work up for criticism. Or you can ask people to 'be gentle' and they'll respect that.

You can't hide from depression. It's a cancer that will weave its way into every facet of your life whether you like it or not. Allowing it to run/ruin your life doesn't help. Normally the depressed person has a hard enough time getting motivated to do much of anything, so I say if you want to write, DO IT. Take that motivation wherever you can get it.

It doesn't matter if the writing is 'good' based on publishing standards. Who cares? The first person anyone should write for is themselves.

 

Through all the debate, I don't even know if the OP still even looks at this thread, but here goes.

This is stating the obvious, but in most cases of depression I've seen and experienced, depression slows down the brain, especially the more severe the case is. I think that might be the reason you can't concentrate or focus. Trying to think clearly through it is like trying to waddle and force your way through this thick mud... and when you can't, it adds to whatever anger and frustration you already harbor towards the helpless feeling you've already been suffering from. Which could be stemming from the depression itself, or caused by the conditions that have lead to the depression, that is, if they exist in the first place. At any rate, it's an extremely uncomfortable place to be in.

I don't know what writing had been like for you before your depression kicked up, but perhaps you could ask yourself this: do you feel better when you keep trying to write, even if you're unsuccessful in your attempt? Or do you just get more frustrated that you can't get anything out on the paper, whatever you do?

If writing through depression sounds as improbable for you as it does for me, maybe you could try writing with depression instead. As several people have said here, it's just using your depression as a raw idea mine, or as motivation to write, even if that motivation is to escape the depression. Anything really, as long as the depression works in favor of your writing. Do you think that could work?

Sorry that you've been going through something like this for three years, northernadams. I'm not a certified psychologist, and I'm far from an expert in medications, but counseling is part of my job at work. If you ever want to talk, I'm willing and might be able to help you, hopefully. I've been consistently dealing with other people's depression, as well as my own when it had reared its ugly head. Thankfully, it's all over with now; and I think the fact that I'm still here now and doing pretty good most days is proof that things do get better. Sometimes, you don't need a cure -- all you need is a helping hand that lets you hang in there until you get better.

Whatever you do, mate, I wish you the best of luck. Choose whatever treatment that you - not other people - think helps.

 

Holy moly, what happened in here???

 

They tried to bake a cake. It all went wrong.

 

I have found it to be incredibly difficult to write during depressing times of my life. Breakups, moving (don't get me started on how much I hate moving), etc..

But writing through grief has been cake. My father died yesterday and writing a tribute to him and what he meant to me, who he was, how he acted... that was simple. The words flowed and I hardly had to edit at all.

Twice I was worried I'd ruin my laptop by crying salty tears all over it but I learned that someone can write with their eyes closed, just as well.

I suppose what I am saying is to pour you feelings into your work when someone close to you passes. Don't feel guilty about putting your feelings on Facebook and breaking your friend's hearts with your words. It is real and helpful and not shallow or trite.

Tell the important people first. Like let's not have your brother finding out that mom died, because of your post on FB. I feel I don't need to tell many of you that, but this is the world of texting...

 

You had me and then you lost me. Not trying to be rude, but aren't making sense of what you're trying to prove here. I do feel bad for your loss though. May your father rest in peace.

 

Well, the title of your post is certainly correct, and this statement is evidence that you are very familiar with the difference. Grief is a reaction, and often, the way people react to something is by writing. Depression is not a reaction, but a deficiency in neurological activity, and one of its many symptoms is the loss of enthusiasm for something, especially a creative endeavor like writing.

 

I am sorry for your loss, @JetBlackGT . And glad that writing about it has helped you get through the shock of it.

I just read an article this morning about writing and mental health, and it made the point that writing about a traumatic event can help you put it into perspective ...put it to rest, in a manner of speaking. This is very healthy. Apparently there have been studies done that show that people who write ...even blogs, letters, whatever ...tend to be mentally and physically more healthy for having done so.

There is something to be said for putting your feelings into words, by writing. However, as you hinted in your post, the act of writing itself is the catalyst for release. Who SEES your writing is another thing entirely. Do be careful what you post on Facebook!

 

I'm sorry for your loss, but it's also good to hear writing has helped you.

I agree with @jannert , writing can be very therapeutic. This is why it saddened me so much to read some writers' and publishers' attitudes towards rape narratives. Maybe they'd make an exception with a story that discussed it in a non-glued-on way, but then again, I don't know if they even care enough to read that far. I find it somehow... dismissive, like rape has, as a topic, become really mundane. Like saying we shouldn't write about death anymore because it's trite and has been done too many times. I don't know. To me it feels like a sucker-punch in the abdomen.

Anyway. Keep on writing if it helps, and if you decide to share your writing with others, remember that it might really help someone else to deal with their loss.

And yeah, depression and grief are quite different. There are similar symptoms, but at least you'll know grief will eventually pass. Hang tough!

 

Many of us have been through this experience. The fact that you've posted so early on in the process demonstrates a rational brain which sees the therapeutic value in talking about an issue.

Too often those grieving are left in the cold because others either don't know what to say, or don't want to intrude. Nothing could be further from the truth.

You've brought your feelings out in the open. I admire your post.

 

Since my Dad had Parkinson's, I mentioned that in the narrative. It was shocking how many of my friends were currently living with a "Parkinson's parent". My words seemed to help them a bit and my only advice applies to everyone in or lives; not just PD sufferers. Here is the text of that thread:
**************************************************************************************

My father died this morning.

Just after noon today, December 16, 2014. He fought Parkinson's for longer than his body could stand and it finally caught up to him. His healthy body prevented his disease from killing him, a long time ago, but I wish, selfishly, that he had been able to fight it even longer.

I'm glad that I got to see him before he died and to tell him that I love him. I wanted to make certain that when he died I did not regret never telling him [fill-in-the-blank]. So even though I am sad, there was nothing left that I needed to tell him. I am grateful for that because I hear about so many other people who left things unsaid or apologies unspoken.

I have never been angry at a disease before. A lot of diabetics hate their diabetes. They want to scream from the top of a mountain, how much they hate it. I never cared at all. But now?

I hate Parkinson's.

It took my father's memories and his thoughts and replaced them with either delusions and terror or confusion and using the wrong words to try to say what he meant.

He spent his life like we all do. Accruing these amazing memories and stories. But at the end they were taken away from him.

But not all of them. Two weeks ago, he knew where I worked and asked me about my car and if I still loved it. He asked about my writing and told the staff, all the time, that that was what I did. I am glad my dad told them because I was not sure he understood that I had finally found what I was meant to do and I wanted him to be proud of me.

It would have been good if I had started soon enough that he could have read some of my stuff but really? His illness is one of many things which really spurred me on. His illness showed me that we DO NOT always have all the time in the world. Some of us don't know that we don't have much of a tomorrow because maybe that bus that's going to run us down is fueling up right now at a station in Wyoming.

My dad was a fighter pilot and an instructor. He tested planes and weapons in Nevada at NWEF and he was a genius. He was a brilliant man and I never heard him criticize anyone. He was delightfully weird and clever, witty and kind.

He was also an expert sleeper. In that way, Parkinson's really suited him. He slept most of every day there at the end. Parkinson's and its attending medications put you out a lot. The thing he said about it was, "At least it doesn't hurt."

And I can agree with him. That part is a blessing. It *is* painless. Physically

 

Hey,

I've been writing one story over a year now. I recently visited doctors / psychiatrist and they diagnozed depression, which has been there for couple of years (quickly evaluated).

Should I keep writing or not? Are there any other writers, who have suffered from depression? Did you write, or did you put your work to a side?

Thanks.

 

What do your doctors and psychiatrists say? What sort of therapy are you undergoing for your depression, and how would writing help/hinder your treatment?

There are lots of writers who've struggled with depression, and a fair number who've lost the fight. You need to do what's best for you, not what's best for some other writer.

 

Plenty of writers have depression. There are folks here on this forum who have depression. Should you write? Well, if it's helping you then I say you should.

 

As long as it isn't a suicide note, keep writing!