Pirated digital books

Discussion in 'Electronic Publishing' started by GingerCoffee, Jun 28, 2015.

  1. Laurin Kelly

    Laurin Kelly Contributor Contributor

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    To clarify, it's the idea that you're able to justify the above internally that I can't grasp. Different strokes for different folks, but I could never do it. Operating with integrity is absolutely vital to my self-esteem.
     
  2. Samuel Lighton

    Samuel Lighton Senior Member

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    No, I do think it is a real thing, I just think that it is a different thing. From the examples people have set, they seem to think it is the exact same thing. In principle, it is the same thing. In effect? Far from it.

    And again, with the really bad comparison examples. Patents are completely different to copyright.

    You can't compare virtual property to real physical examples, the best you can do is apply it to similar mediums, like music and video. To which my argument still applies, I'm not going to throw money at a worthless thing just because it looks or sound shiny. I'm going to investigate my purchase first and then decide to invest. If I can not find any means of gaining a legitimate measure of the project, the only way to find out if it is, is to experience it and then decide. Some mediums are better at providing that required experience to reach that judgement. Books are the worst for it.
     
  3. Laurin Kelly

    Laurin Kelly Contributor Contributor

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    This is where I struggle too. I mean, how does one determine where to draw the line? Or do they just not draw it at all? It confuses me greatly.
     
  4. Samuel Lighton

    Samuel Lighton Senior Member

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    Because some books don't have verifiable information.
     
  5. Mumble Bee

    Mumble Bee Keep writing. Contributor

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    Heh, stealing from 'friends', you're making a lot of assumptions about my social life...

    When I say I'll 'find a way' to get what i need if I don't have the resources, it doesn't mean I'll skip straight to stealing it. Think of it this way
    I need to get an A in class X, however after studying, its become apparent I'm not capable, but that's not going to stop me from passing, so my options are:
    A: convince another person to tutor me
    B:Get the answers, cheat on the test
    C:get the teacher to give me a better grade (could be blackmail, bribery, emotional manipulation, whatevs)
    D:get into the teachers grading program and change my grade to an A

    Obviously, the route with the highest success rate and lowest risk is option A, but that option isn't always available.

    There's no justification going on here, I don't think i'm a good person for doing this, but there is a limit being placed on myself (the whole point of my post earlier that i dont have/can't get the resources to purchase something) and I will not let a limitation stop me from getting what I want if i'm capable of getting it. I'll always try the acceptable approach first, but that is by no means my only attempt.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 24, 2016
  6. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    How?
     
  7. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    If there's not a word about a book out there, how do you even know that you want to steal it? How did you even find out that it exists?
     
  8. Laurin Kelly

    Laurin Kelly Contributor Contributor

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    Okay, let's talk copyright then. If someone plagiarizes my book and releases it under a different name and changes the character names, is it still not theft? I can still sell the original, right?
     
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  9. Samuel Lighton

    Samuel Lighton Senior Member

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    For me, it's about damage done. If I'm in a position where I can not, and may not ever, be able to put money into books then my choice is either to never have books or pirate books. If I pirate your book, you would not be at a loss, because I am in a situation where I could not get your book anyway. No possibility of a sale in either of the two choices that I have. However, I am now in possession of your book, which I have pirated. You still would not have gotten any money from me because of my situation, but now I have your book. You can either view it as "That son of a bitch stole from me" or "I'm glad my book is being read, and people are willing to resort to piracy to do so."

    Not for one second is this you being grateful because piracy exists. Screw that.
     
  10. Samuel Lighton

    Samuel Lighton Senior Member

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    Public Library.
     
  11. Samuel Lighton

    Samuel Lighton Senior Member

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    Oh no, that's blatant theft. That's stealing your intellectual construct and abusing it for their own profiteering. It's still different from piracy though.
     
  12. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    So....you didn't want to get a library card, due to the life-threatening coffee-free environs?
     
  13. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Or brave those caffeine-free environs.

    Edited to add: By the way, coffee costs money. If the lack of coffee is a factor, the lack of money is not.
     
  14. Laurin Kelly

    Laurin Kelly Contributor Contributor

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    Well, that so neatly puts the responsibility on me quite nicely, doesn't it? I guess you bear no responsibility for your actions when all that really matters is how I perceive them as either negative or positive.
     
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  15. Laurin Kelly

    Laurin Kelly Contributor Contributor

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    So theft is only theft when it's for certain reasons and circumstances?
     
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  16. Samuel Lighton

    Samuel Lighton Senior Member

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    Caffeine is my lifeforce for the time being, so I have to facetiously say yes to both.


    There are a few instances where you would see a rare book and not be able to find any information on it. Some relatively old books won't have much of any a word said about them, then again in that situation you probably would have a hard time finding a pirated copy.

    My point was that if I can't verify a book, because of lack of information or severe conflicting sources, I'd investigate myself. You can't just read the first few pages to get the jist of an entire book though, nor could you open it in the middle and glean enlightenment from it. The only way then would be to read the book. Then you have two options. Buy the book and read it, or pirate the book and read it. Pirating the book is a no risk with all the reward method. Aside from being caught, at which point, hefty fines.

    But it does mean money doesn't go to people that don't deserve it. Like if you had two books that you could buy. One of them is touted as being amazing in a few reviews, the other hasn't had too much said about it. If you were to make a choice on buying the book, based on quality, you'd be prejudiced towards the one with the amazing reviews. Now you could buy that book, or you could pirate them both. Once you've pirated them, you read the books and come to two conclusions. The first book that was called 'amazing' turns out to be anything but. In fact, you feel like you wasted your time reading it, and the instant catharsis is that at least you didn't spend any money on it. The second book turns out to be really great though. You enjoyed every section of it, every word. You feel good about the experience, so decide to buy that book.

    You give money to the person that wrote a good book. They aren't selling sweets, cars or anything like that. They're selling stories, and they should be paid because they told a good story. Not just because someone was coaxed into simply saying it was good.
     
  17. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    But surely you could do a better job than him. His concept would get more exposure and more readers. You'd be doing him a favor!

    Again, if you're willing to steal, it's always easy to find an excuse to steal what you really want to.
     
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  18. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Interlibrary loan.

    Interlibrary loan.

    Interlibrary loan.
     
  19. Samuel Lighton

    Samuel Lighton Senior Member

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    If I stole medicine from a pharmacy to cure my daughters illness when she would otherwise die, and no one else would need it, are you going to throw me in jail? If I killed a man because he was going to blow up a shopping mall, would you punish me for murder? If you're a moral person, you know that these two examples have conflicting standards. On the one hand, I robbed a pharmacy. On the other, I saved a life. In the second case, I killed a man. One of the worst crimes you can commit. But I saved a shopping mall full of people.

    If you want to say that there is no condition whatsoever you can accept someone illegally reading a copy of your book, then you also can never say you would not punish the people in the two examples above for their crimes in full. I can accept that if I publish a book, I fully expect piracy to be involved, but I won't hate on it and say it's 'good for nothing' because I know it's giving something back in exposure, which is pretty much free advertising. It isn't going way, it's staying around for the foreseeable future, and there is nothing at all you can do about it without hurting your own sales.
     
  20. Samuel Lighton

    Samuel Lighton Senior Member

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    Could probably do a better job. Maybe change the title too. That's a dead give away.

    But yeah, they would get more exposure. There would be an inevitable legal battle, that stuff always makes news. People love their drama.
     
  21. Samuel Lighton

    Samuel Lighton Senior Member

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    Bookstores don't loan you books.

    Bookstores don't loan you books.


    Bookstores don't loan you books.
     
  22. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Whose life are you saving with the pirated books?

    Interlibrary...no, wait: Police.

    Whose life are you saving with the pirated books?
     
  23. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Yes....and? Who said that this needed to involve bookstores? Go to the library. I realize that they don't sell caffeine right inside, but you can periodically run out and get some, like a dolphin surfacing for air.
     
  24. Laurin Kelly

    Laurin Kelly Contributor Contributor

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    I'm astounded by your dedication to make sure every book reading experience you have is outstanding, and that every dollar you spend only goes towards things you like and are never let down by.

    If my book's not your jam that still doesn't mean you get it for free. Just because you didn't get anything out of the experience doesn't mean the book is worthless. The time and money I and my publisher have spent putting my book on the market hoping to get enough interest that readers will give it a try is worth recouping. If I put my house on the market at too high a value you don't have to buy it, but you don't get to live in it for free either while you do a cost/benefit analysis.
     
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  25. ChickenFreak

    ChickenFreak Contributor Contributor

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    Deleted duplicate post.
     

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