It's very valuable. You'll need to develop a thick skin and not worry too much if people don't like what you do. Not everyone will. You can always disagree if they don't get it, or if their suggestions seem incorrect to you. But they may really give good feedback you can work on and learn a lot about how people are reacting to what you're making. A good rule for you right now is simple: write everything. Write your prologues, narration, epilogues, everything. Put it all on the page. And then, when you figure out what's going on in the work, cut cut cut cut cut cut until only the important bits are left. Writing is re-writing.
Thanks again for your observations. Clearly people read in an entirely different way than I do, which is very interesting to be made aware of. My female INFJ friend who is copping the brunt of my creative outbursts is handy with the C word, so opening with a couple of fucks seems almost tame
I disagree. Your suggestion sounds like classic ---P whereas my INTJ nature prefers pretty much the opposite. This is in line with programming, which I have done for a few decades now, professionally. I am a thinker and a planner. Very goal oriented. I have the arcs of all three novels pencilled in, and will have the plot of the first novel nailed down before I start writing in earnest. The process outlined in the 2k to 10k writing book I finished reading recently is great in that that is how I operate. Map, plan, start at the end and work your way back, etc, etc. It's also aligned with how I set up coaching programs for the cyclists I coach. Very methodical and goal oriented. And willfully patient. I'm in no rush to get it finished and feel no pressure to get it started. I prefer Miyamoto Musashi's one strike approach to sword fights - entirely focused and direct. Yes, there will be editing and cutting and what not, but how I write will be far more focused and direct than "just write everything and then figure out what's going on".
Yes, I am learning this as I discuss ideas and what not with my friend. She has contributed a couple of things that are out of left field, and once I understand what she has said, absolutely invaluable. I'll see how I go here. Hopefully I can write some flash fiction or poetry stuff and get feedback via those avenues at least.
See how easy it is to take or leave suggestions/criticism? The same thing will happen when you post work. Nothing to worry about. In the end we all end up finding our own path.
Well pedantically it was a suggestion of what to do, not a criticism of what I had written, but yeah sure. Not too difficult
Since English isn't my first language, I don't have the right context that'd make me balk at profanity. So I just read it, register that it's a swear word, not particularly mild one but still very common, and read on to find out what's the system, what's its significance, how it's fucked, and is everyone fucked now 'cause the system is fucked?? So, no problem to me. Starting with dialogue; not a problem either.
There's something I learned in Improv, SELL IT. It doesn't matter what it is, if you don't sell it, you've lost the audience. I didn't read works critically until college as an English Lit major. The majority of the population does not read works critically. What most readers are looking for is escapism. They want to bond with a character that is like them. I don't know about you all, but I have several friends who couldn't make it 15 minutes without dropping the F-bomb, and it's just who they are, the way they speak. In other words, do you think it's too much for you to sell? There's one page of Catcher in the Rye that has, and I swear to this, like 13 instances of the word "crummy". I wanted to hang myself before I finished that, but he sold that book, that character. If you can sell it, then do it. Surely these two F-bombs aren't quite as out there as beginning the pilot episode of your show with "Apocalypse, Apocalypse, we caused you with our dumbness" being sung by four women in an underground bunker as they hold hands around a christmas tree....
I've struggled with similar decisions concerning profanity, especially in the first line of the story. Here's what I've decided: even if the profanity fits the character, the situation, and the story as a whole, using it in the first line risks undermining your credibility as an author. Profanity for its own sake is no longer labels the author as a risk-taker, but rather as an attention-seeker using profanity as a cheap tagline to entice the reader. Whether that is the case or not, plenty of readers won't stick around to find out. My advice is to give yourself some context before using profanity (at least the f-word) and then use it where it fits.
I don't think it's too much. I will give you this to chew on however- I bought my first page into the writers group I go to, and the third paragraph had my MC think, "stinging little fuckers" about fire ants. There were three people in that group who said they would stop reading right there. I personally don't think that's valid critique, and they probably aren't my target audience anyway, but those people made a huge deal about it. Like others noted, there will always be people who love and hate what you write and you can't please everyone.
Yes I am coming to the same conclusion having finished one novel that I did not enjoy last week, a follow up / ~sequel novel that was marginally better, and then this week a novel that would have me purchase a sequel without thought. Thanks for the real life example.
I've read quite a bit of Stephen King, and he tends to be quite heavy on the profanity, even when opening chapters. Personally, I don't mind it, and it's part of everyday life. That's the question isn't it -- are we mimicking life, or creating art? Or is life art? Just go with it, and if your critics recoil in discontent, then just change it to something less conspicuous.
