The beginning of a work of a apologetics. Is it clear?

Discussion in 'Word Mechanics' started by waitingforzion, Dec 4, 2017.

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  1. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    that's a logical circle man knows something because he knows it - meaningless sentence, not needed

    All you need say is "He has given Man the laws, by which He will judge the world, on the day that He has appointed

    Also I wasn't aware that there was an appointed day for the day of judgement according to the bible
     
  2. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    No, I need to express that man knows that there is a divine law, not just that he was given a law, and I need to express that it is his conscience that tells him this.

    There is an appointed day of judgment according to the Bible, but the time is not known to man, only to God. Also, there are two different judgments, the Great White Throne judgment, and the Judgment Seat of Christ. The first is for the unbelievers, who will be cast into the lake of fire. The second is for the believers, who will receive rewards according to what they have done in this life. The second happens before the first though, I think. The Great White Throne judgment happens immediately after the final resurrection.
     
  3. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    Surely knowing it and his conscience telling him it are the same thing

    "He has put in the conscious of man the laws by which the world will be judged, on day He has appointed"
     
  4. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    So its not an appointed time then, if it is unknown except to god. You could just say "on the day of judgement"
     
  5. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    No it is still an appointed day, which God has appointed. Even in the Bible it says, "because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world"
     
  6. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    I revised it again.

     
  7. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    I revised it even one more time.

     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2017
  8. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    I wouldn' start the sentence on and, that could be a comma and a lower case a but other than that I think this is as clear as its going to get
     
  9. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    Okay I fixed the conjunction problem. I also made a change you probably didn't see as I was editing my previous post.

     
  10. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    "and made this to be shown to them by their conscience" is a really clunky construction , and tbh you don't need it at all.... if you are wedded to mentioning the conscience i'd say something like

    "God, who according to His wisdom has created the world to show His love and glory, has left in the heavens and in the earth signs and proof that He formed them. He gave also to man a law embedded in his conscience, and by that law He will judge the world, on the day that He has ordained.

    That aside as i said above you really need to stop fiddling with this and get on with writing the piece - its becoming an excuse for procrastination
     
  11. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    Yeah it didn't sound good to me either. But I was trying to put the word "conscience" at the end of the clause. And I was trying to signify that God has made man's conscience show that there is a law.

    Just to be clear, what does clunky mean in this context?
     
  12. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    Also, I think it could be worded like this as well:

    "God, who according to His wisdom has created the world to show His love and glory, has left in the heavens and in the earth signs and proof that He formed them. He gave also to man a law revealed to him by his conscience, and by that law He will judge the world, on the day that He has ordained."

    For some reason that option of syntax did not occur to me.
     
  13. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    I wrote two posts in reply to this, but I revised my sentences once again.

    Do you think that this is better?
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2017
  14. newjerseyrunner

    newjerseyrunner Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2022

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    Am I the only one who's concerned that this level of scrutiny is place on the first sentences this early into the writing process? It seems to me that with any creative process getting into the details too early causes the entire project to be too rigid to edit later.

    A nice analogy I like to use is painting, nobody starts by doing details, they create a rough outline, then add undertones, midtones, then overtones, and polish is only the final step.
    [​IMG]
     
  15. big soft moose

    big soft moose An Admoostrator Admin Staff Supporter Contributor Community Volunteer

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    I said that too - to me it feels like another excuse not to write anything
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
    ChickenFreak and newjerseyrunner like this.
  16. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    How is this? Is it any better?

    "God, who created all things to show His love and glory, has placed signs and proof in the heavens and the earth showing that He has made them. He gave also to men a law by which He will judge the world, and formed their conscience that it might bear witness to the law that He has given them."
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2017
  17. waitingforzion

    waitingforzion Banned

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    Not sure if I used the infinitive properly, but here is another revision:

    "God, who created all things to show His love and glory, has fashioned the heavens and the earth to declare that He has made them. He gave also to men a law by which He will judge the world, and formed their conscience to bear witness to the law that He has given them."
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2017
  18. Wreybies

    Wreybies Thrice Retired Supporter Contributor

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    Here is something I have made clear more than once, in many places, and over the entire length of time that I have been some flavor of staff here in our little slice of the internet:

    The upper portion of the forum - the subforums of which are collectively known as Creative Writing - is for specific questions regarding the topics that each of the subforums encompases. The posting of work, in whole or in part, for the purpose of getting general critique is to be done in the Writing Workshop, an area that has some requirements as regards its use, which answer to the tune of reciprocation. Community enforced reciprocation is the core facet, the key element, that keeps our forum from devolving into one of the uncountable rinkydink writing forums scattered across the internet where participation is slim, daily post-count is in the single digits, and help is as rare as hen's teeth. It's a concept we take directly from live writing circles and for very similar reasons.

    Waitingforzion, you have been a member here nearly as long as I have. The aforementioned paradigm has been in place in our forum since the beginning. I think that no one can argue that enough latitude on this matter has been afforded. It's time you either join in with the way things work here, else hang your hat elsewhere. I will close any further threads that answer to the tune of "here's some writing, is it clear?" that I find outside the Writing Workshop, and which have not been earned in advance with the standard 2-for-1 reciprocal critique, as the rest of us have always been doing. I'm not going to haggle over technicalities. The spirit of how our forum functions needs to be respected, else all is chaos.

    :closed:
     
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