The Not Happy Thread

I generally don't get flu shots just because I always remember people saying there was limited supply, so I thought I should let more vulnerable people get the shot first. Then I usually forget about it until next flu season and do the same thing. I think I probably have had the flu, but not so badly or recently that I can remember when, so I guess my current tactic (or lack of one) seems to be working for me. What I find more troubling is people that don't seem to practice basic hygiene. I'm fairly certain that washing our hands when we're done using the lavatory has done more to prevent the spread of disease than the flu shot ever has.

 

CDC is not a vaccine manufacturer.

Vaccines are well understood by medical providers and researchers. Vaccines are immunology 101.

Now I, on the other hand, have some bizarre one-off auto-immune disease. Trust me, auto-immune diseases are not well understood. Vaccines, those are kid's play.

 

That was true for a cluster of years a while back. And in 2009 it took a while to develop and distribute the vaccine for the variant that emerged. 2009v was one damn serious flu. I'm surprised people still take flu so casually since that pandemic.

We've not had any flu vaccine shortages recently.

Not just after using the bathroom, flu is not spread via the fecal oral route. But washing one's hands before eating and taking a lot more care not to put your hands inadvertently in one's eyes, nose, or mouth.

If people would learn how to keep their hands cleaner, cough into their elbow crook and not one's hands, stop contaminating the surfaces we all touch like doorknobs and handrails, we'd all be sick less often.


Edited to add, influenza in chickens is spread in their feces.

 

I'm sorry. My agent had Lupus and that is something I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy.

 

Yeah, that's one of the worst of these autoimmune disease complexes.

 

I was thinking just more disease in general. I'd honestly prefer the flu than cholera. Not to mention having other people's poo bugs floating around in and on me is just plain nasty. I think I'm going to go take a shower.

 

Actually I don't think that's true. If you have a chance of spreading, say, Cholera, via your pee then you almost certainly got it from the water that you're washing your hands in. Sure, better hygiene can't hurt anything but it's more of a 'can't hurt' than 'you will get sick if you don't'.

The flu shot probably hasn't saved all that many lives either, with modern medicine you don't have much chance of actually dying of flu unless it's 1918-style Spanish Flu (fun fact; that strain caused massive haemorrhaging including from the nose, ears and gut) but it certainly contributes to keeping outbreaks shorter and the number of infections lower. Statistically it's saved lives just by doing that, even the shot hasn't directly ensured someone who would have died survived.

 

Oh for pity's sake. We're drifting off topic but if I may say without pissing you off too much, your facts leave a lot to be desired.

 

I didn't say they were. But they're the ones who have to approve vaccines and vaccine ingredients. They're the ones that pass off research and clear vaccines for production/use.

Yeah, except for things we have yet to fully understand. Such as problems with vaccine shedding, how different humans (due to their genetics) filter absorbed metals from their body, the affects of 'multi-vaccines' and how to apply vaccines to large groups of people. There's a lot of things we can still learn about vaccines. I know that people generally get very defensive over vaccine science these days due to all the anti-vaccine movements and conspiracies related to vaccines, but it's not at all out of line to suggest that our science with vaccines isn't perfect. Scientists know this and are always researching to make better and safer vaccines. Vaccine companies are pretty unscrupulous in their business practices, as well, which has always made the whole issue worse.

 

This seems to be more related to politics than immunology.

 

You misunderstand. The issue isn't the distribution or whatever, it's how to introduce vaccines to a huge group of people, like when we attempt to vaccinate thousands of people in underdeveloped countries. When you vaccinate a fuckload of people like that, there are tons of problems associated with it. Lots of the people go off and shed their vaccines onto unvaccinated communities and can cause outbreaks. Other times you have an issue of a vaccine designed for people in one country literally not working the same way on people in an entirely different genetic pool, and the vaccines don't work right. The amount of people harmed from stuff like the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, for instance, is really frightening.

 

To which bit? When diseases come from human waste it's almost always due to contaminated water supplies, not because people didn't wash hands in the bathroom. If you want to talk about doctors not washing hands between patients, sure, but that's not the same thing.

As for flu deaths; seriously it's really unlikely to kill you. 35,000 deaths from 15 to 60 million infections is really unlikely; 1 in 40,000. But, as I said, the vaccine still stops people being infected and for every 40,000 people you avoid infecting you save someone's life, as well as lot of time and money spent treating them.

 

So when the the guy with a severe GI infection used the toilet before you, doesn't bother washing his hands, leaves some greasy micro nuggets on the door handle and you magically come down with the same disease, that's not because either one you you didn't wash your hands?

 

No they don't. The FDA does that.

I can't address the misinformation in this thread any further without incurring the wrath of the unicorn.

It's time to end this line of misinquiry.

 

Actually I said that it does help to wash hands, but that I think flu shots have saved more lives.

Look, airborne diseases travel much more reliably that diseases that spread through contact. For you to get sick from someone who didn't wash their hands that specific person must already be sick, have actually gotten poop on their hands, not washed them, have touched something that you will later touch, and then you have to stick your hand in your mouth. For you to get flu someone near to you needs to sneeze.

Washing your hands helps not to spread diseases, especially if you work around people with compromised immune systems. It helps. But we just don't live in a society where people who wash their hands obsessively have substantially higher life expectancy. It helps, but it's not a critical factor unless you know you were in contact with someone who has a disease transmissible that way.

 

Some are some aren't. Cholera and hepatitis E are frequently due to water contamination. But hepatitis A and norovirus are pretty much from contaminated food and that is contaminated from fecal contamination on hands.

I'm done with influenza misinformation in this thread.

 

Just another FYI, the majority of influenza is droplet spread, not airborne. Only a few strains have been documented to be truly airborne.

Droplet spread travels about 3 feet from the infected person so you can get it when someone coughs in your face. But the main mechanism of spread is probably hands.

 

No, the FDA are the ones who oversee a vaccine's approval (for actual use, not just for trials- the FDA does the trials after the CDC says it's okay), production and use and monitor the vaccine.

You ever think that presenting no sources or anything of your own and then saying "okay I can't handle this wrongess goodbye" might not be a great way to have a discussion or an argument?

 

:chill:

STOP.

Guys/gals, please take it to the debate room. I can see you’re not happy, but this vac discussion does not belong to this thread anymore.

 

Since I'm banned from the debate room, I can't. However, thank you for ending the discussion here where it didn't belong.

 

Yeah, take it to the communal water pump.

 

Mind the cholera

 

I submitted a couple of shorts to FFO, rejected in minutes - but posted in block paragraphs, so obviously the stories were good or brilliant, it was the paragraph alignment. My god that paragraph alignment holding me back in my burgeoning career, every time, and the pink font. Bastards. Should have done my 'Shun.' Also, Shun indents the opening paragraph. How can that be, is that right?

How to depress yourself with a self-inflicted wound, send your literary fiction to a sci-fi magazine...and the short stories to FFO. 'Now remember children, write your cover letter properly...'

'Arse..'

 

Nah, the pink font is what readers love. It's both attention getting and shows personality! If it's anything, it's probably your actual typeface. If you're still using Times New Roman, junk that crunk. Switch to something more elegant, like some wafty script. It may be hard to decipher, but taking the extra time to scroll through your font menu to find the most unreadable one shows that you take your writing seriously. And when in doubt, Comic Sans is always a good choice.

 

Wingdings allows only the most dedicated and discerning readers access, solidifying your credentials as an R-Teest of the highest calibrification.