Novel Titles

Discussion in 'Genre Discussions' started by Charisma, Sep 10, 2007.

  1. mammamaia

    mammamaia nit-picker-in-chief Contributor

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    many bestsellers that had nothing [or little] to do with relgion have had biblical titles... people either get the connection, or they don't, but the titles worked well either way...
     
  2. Jonias

    Jonias Member

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    I was thinking of "Joy Cometh in the Morning", but I did a search recently and there are so many books (mostly Christian) called "Joy Comes in the Morning" I am beginning to rethink that.

    My other idea was "After the Wind". Doesn't sound too religious and fits the theme pretty well, but some might find it plain and perhaps a bit too ambiguous.
     
  3. Trilby

    Trilby Contributor Contributor

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    I like After the Wind.
    Joy Cometh in The Morning for me would be a definite No-No!
    But it is up to you.
     
  4. Pen

    Pen New Member

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    Titles and subtitles are probably the most meaningful individual words in a book, and they set the tone. A story with a title that is a Biblical allusion immediately conjures images of epic stories, classical heroes and villains and a strong idea of external morality- well, either that or a subversion of the same!

    The title should come from the meaning of the work- presumably if you're looking in the Bible for your titles you got some of your story ideas in the same place- which verses in the Bible encapsulate the story idea?
     
  5. twopounder

    twopounder New Member

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    I point out many titles that have become movies:

    Book of Eli, Kingdom of Heaven, Armageddon, etc etc.

    And even those that haven't: Anvil of God, So long and Thanks for All the Fish, Damocles Crusade, etc etc.

    People are drawn by titles. Most people don't really know what is religious. Gideon, for example, is HIGHLY religious, but you will find his name in numerous texts that don't involve the Jewish religion. The truth is, people gravitate towards the interesting and unusual. I doubt using a religious title will harm your book in the slightest.

    There are dozens of books with Religious titles that are not religious in any way, shape, or form. Hell, ever read/watched a story about a human becoming an angel? Yeah BS, the bible specifically states that humans and angels are unrelated.

    So, people correlate where they will and draw lines where they wont.
     
  6. Pen

    Pen New Member

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    True, titles with religious themes don't say the content will be religious, but I'd expect there to be some sort of Biblical allusion. If a book was titled "Gideon", I'd expect themes of triumphant faith or loyalty and victory over oppression, whether or not that loyalty was to a god or an earthly being.

    The Bible might say angels are not humans with wings (seraphim indeed are meant to be Lovecraftian horrors), but pop-religion tends to understand that they are at least capable of appearing as kindly youngish people with a sort of innate aura.
     
  7. digitig

    digitig Contributor Contributor

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    "After the Wind" makes me think somebody has eaten to many Brussels sprouts and baked beans -- is that what you meant by "ambiguous"?
     
  8. Pen

    Pen New Member

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    I'd say that a possible comic interpretation needs something to stand on- while wind does mean farting, unless you had constant imagery of heavenly trumpets and "the wind at my back", people wouldn't give the interpretation much credit.
     
  9. Vintage

    Vintage New Member

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    So if I name my main character and possibly my entire book "Samael", what would that bring to mind?
     
  10. Elgaisma

    Elgaisma Contributor Contributor

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    Or it could just be the main character's name. Heck I have a couple of people struggling with the idea that Socrates in Socrates' Children is not a Greek Philopsopher. Not about to change the name of a character I have had for four books just because some people can't distinguish a name from a historical character.
     
  11. Trilby

    Trilby Contributor Contributor

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    Not an image that comes to my mind - I'm thinking more Gone With the Wind, Clarke Gable.
     
  12. Jonias

    Jonias Member

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    :D No, though you brought a smile to my face there. XD

    See, "After the Wind" comes from Ecclesiastes; the context is "chasing after the wind"...but without the first word it's a bit more ambiguous: does it mean "after the wind has swept everything you had away"? Both interpretations fit the theme fairly well, though it's a bit more complex than that.

    Hm...don't know about classical villains and heroes, (villains, maybe, though the hero begins to take on a Faustian character as he evolves). The sense of good and evil is mostly internal (at least in the case of the MC) but it's definitely a sweeping, old fashioned tale. Not to the point of being simplistic or underdeveloped (I hope!), but it does have those grand, old-fashioned themes.

    I wanted a title that sounded raw and melancholic while at the same time implying a glimmer of hope and a refusal to give in. The despair you find in the Hebrew Bible, written as it was around the time of the exile, sort of reflects this. Their sense of loyalty to their god (in spite of being constantly persecuted and having every reason not to), fits the theme perfectly, especially because he was later seen as the ideal of goodness itself. The MC struggles with loyalty to those dear to him even though in a more material sense they are tearing his life apart.

    Epic? Depends on what you mean. It begins as a very small and intimate story, though the consequences of the drama become very epic towards the end. In ultimate implications? Absolutely. But the cast is too small for me to consider it an "epic" (it's novella length...not really enough page space to focus on more than a few characters if you want to do them any justice).
     
  13. digitig

    digitig Contributor Contributor

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    In fact, I did go off on that wrong tangent too. I thought of the Brecht's quote "All that will remain of these cities is that which passes through them: the wind." ("Von diesen Stadten wird bleiben der durch sie hindurchgang: der Wind"). And so after the wind? Desolation beyond desolation. I also thought of a couple of other Bible passages, such as after the wind coming a still, small voice and after the wind coming tongues of fire.
     
  14. Spacer

    Spacer Active Member

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    A serial killer.

    Or I'd be distracted trying to figure out the unusual name or spelling. Is it pronounced like "Samuel"?
     
  15. Pen

    Pen New Member

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    Samael [e: pronounced sam-ay-el, IIRC] as a title would instantly suggest to me that there was something destructive generally and Satanic specifically about the character and story- if the title is the name of the character I'd expect a very character-focused book, so perhaps an intense character study of a conflicted evildoer or antihero.

    Samael in popular culture is more satanic than his original incarnation as a sort of heavenly accuser and devil's advocate. At first glance, just about any name with the suffix "-ael" conjures images of fallen angels.

    The point isn't really that it's an absolute truth that any character called Gideon must be a transplanted Biblical Gideon, but that the name, especially as the title of the book, would have readers looking for biblical themes.

    Gideon is certainly obscure enough that the character's name alone might simply indicate an antiquated setting, but if the name is to have significance it will probably be Biblical, and I would definitely look for biblical links if there was more to support that theme.

    I haven't read "Socrates' Children", but immediately I would imagine that this is the ancient philosopher, and his "children" would be his students, both past and present or those who adapted his theories and practice. Perhaps there are others called Socrates, but the name is sufficiently associated with one man to immediately look for those themes.

    If I were to read the blurb and see something entirely different, my mind might change but the first thought would be of philosophy and I might as a result see things that aren't there in the text.

    A theme that is mirrored in the Bible and indeed summed up in a Bible verse does not immediately conjure images of gods and devils, especially if there is no explicit supernatural in the story. It sounds as though this is a fine basis for choosing the title you did, and it's not one that would have me instantly think "gods and devils"- the quote would have meaning even to those who didn't see it as a Bible reference.
     
  16. Vintage

    Vintage New Member

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    That's odd, because I did a bit of research into the name and its origins, and "-ael" actually means "Of God".

    Nonetheless, your first thoughts on the subject were a pretty good match with what I am trying to make, so I'll stick with that name. :p
     
  17. Pen

    Pen New Member

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    True, the suffix does denote things of God (as in the commonly "good" angels Michael, Gabriel and Raphael), but similarly to Lucifer there are angels that range in their attitude to Man and indeed God from neutral to utter hostility. Azrael, for example, is the Angel of Death and a personification of evil in Hebrew folklore.
     
  18. Heather Munn

    Heather Munn New Member

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    I really think "After the Wind" is a good title.

    I wasn't sure what part of the Bible you got it from, though, until you said so, and I'm not only a Christian but just got done reading my usual morning chapter of it! But I don't really think that's a weakness, because it's a good phrase in itself. Yes, it does have a melancholy sort of feel to it. Also, the thing people were saying about turning off non-religious readers is not a problem at all with this one. It's the sort of thing you realize is a reference to scripture only once some further allusion or the story itself has put it in context for you.

    If you want people to understand the "chasing after the wind" bit (and the futility it's supposed to represent), it wouldn't necessarily be a bad idea to title it "Chase After the Wind"... but "After the Wind" is really probably better. So then, for your readers to get the context I suggest using either the whole sentence or at least the phrase "chasing after the wind" somewhere in the book, at a moment when you're really bringing the themes out.

    And yeah, "joy in the morning" pretty much has the status of a Christian cliche by now. It's too bad, b/c it's a great phrase... which is of course why it's been so overused. Oh well.

    I also want to say that in this age when so many people think of religious people as fanatics, I really appreciate your sympathy for the passion involved in worship, etc... it's just nice to hear someone say that.
     
  19. digitig

    digitig Contributor Contributor

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    Not necessarily so in the UK -- Gideon Coe is a fairly well-known broadcaster, so the name is still 'live'.
     
  20. Elgaisma

    Elgaisma Contributor Contributor

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    Gideon is fairly popular amongst my children's age groups there has been an explosion in biblical old testament type names. (I have a Gabriel and an Isaac both names in the UK top 100)
     
  21. Lennon

    Lennon New Member

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    If the biblical reference still has relevance to your story I suggest you go with it - never underestimate the power of gut instinct!

    True it could initially make someone think it is a biblical/religious book but there are ways around that with synopsis and marketing - so if it suits go with it!
     
  22. ILoveWriting

    ILoveWriting New Member

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    I have not a clue what title to give my story. The story main is in 'Plot Creation' under the thread name 'Cool...Weird...Dumb but I'm still doing it'.

    Hope you can help!!

    MG;):p:):D
     
  23. VM80

    VM80 Contributor Contributor

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    Do you have some titles in mind you cannot decide between?

    If you post them, it may be easier for people to give feedback. :)

    Otherwise my advice would be to let the title come to you, as you write. I've had that happen quite a few times. Sometimes ideas present themselves when you least expect it.
     
  24. FictionAddict

    FictionAddict New Member

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    I, personally, don't worry about the title until I finish the story. Finish it. The title will come to you eventually.
     
  25. Hocus Pocus

    Hocus Pocus New Member

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    I reckon (if the boy is blamed for something he didn't do ) the titles, 'I didn't do it' and ' Life's Unfair!' are good.
     

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