Villains - Totally evil?

Discussion in 'Character Development' started by para_noir, May 7, 2008.

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  1. Darkthought

    Darkthought Active Member

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    Maybe its not that the villain seems to become less evil as the story progresses, but that the reader begins to identify more with him/her. Many times it is the fact that we identify with the villain that makes us hate the character. We see traits prominent in the villain that we may share and not be so proud of, things that the villain has done that we could see ourselves doing.
     
  2. Krisser

    Krisser New Member

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    1) Is there a specific age range that I have to put him/her into? For example, I want my villain to be 26. Is that too young?

    It depends. Does your villain come from a long line of antagonists? Or did he start his own evil empire from scratch?

    2) Does he/she have to be completely evil? Or should I put in a streak of good into his/her character? Maybe some unusual qualities? If so, could you gimme some examples?

    No one is completely evil, not even Hitler. I mean, he loved animals so much he refused to eat them. And he was known to describe the haunting circumstances of animal slaughterhouses to his dinner guests. Making your character deep down to his bitter, black heart will give him/her a 1 dimensional and flat personality.

    But, you know, don't make your villain burst into tears if someone squishes a caterpillar.

    3) What type of personality should I give? Loner or Maniac? Which is more....believable/hate-able?


    Well, let's look at statistics here. School shootings rarely are lead by social, outgoing misanthropes. They're always bullied and picked on and have to eat their lunch alone. So loner might be your best bet.

    BUT while maniacal is a bit overused, it's certainly interesting. I do like the twisted antagonists. Why not both? Being alone could just drive him further and further off the edge...

    4) And finally, the naming. I can't think of a good name that is not too suggestive of his 'evilness' and not too angelic. I need something in the middle. I was thinking of Marcus Hyde. But that sounds evil in itself. And I don't want the name to be obvious of his nature. And suggestions?

    I agree with Cheeno: real criminals have real names. Why force it?
     
  3. Celereon

    Celereon New Member

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    Well hello, this is my first post here although I've been reading these forums for quite some time. This thread was very helpful.

    I have a very...unusual...villain and I wanted to put some ideas in here, see what you guys thought.

    The story goes that for the majority of it the villain is seen as a 21 year old female. She has no good in her whatsoever (I'll get to that), and she's superhuman, meaning not only is she undefeated in combat, she comes back to life after a while if she dies.

    At the end of it all the ultimate villain is revealed to be a sort of insane genius who actually created this female (genetic modification and all that) to be his weapon, thus the superhumanity and the evil-ness.

    This guy wants to destroy like 90% of the world's population because Earth became overpopulated and even though measures were put in place, he sees that we're destroying the world with our ignorance and so he decides that if we all died, and a select few were left, he could re-educate us and rule as Emperor (plus with his superhuman thing he need never die) and thus save the world, if you will. So the 'ultimate villain', he has a reason behind his deeds, but the female, she's just pure evil. In this particular case, is that such a good idea, or should I change her character around a little bit?

    I'm barely a third of the way through the story, and the girl's only been around for a few chapters, so it's not too hard to edit the stuff atm.
    Thanks heaps.
    Cel.
     
  4. Tragic Author

    Tragic Author New Member

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    hmm. not sure why, but it reminded me of i am legend...

    anyway, it sounds like a really scary villian to me. it sounds like you're discribing one of those i'll-do-it-myself-with-no-one-else's-help-and-if-you-try-to-interfere-i'll-kill-you kind of villians. i like it. =D i'd like to see how that story turns out.

    all sounds okay just as long as they have at least one weakness. every villian does, but it usually takes the whole book to find out what it is. good luck

    T*A
     
  5. starrynight89

    starrynight89 New Member

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    I don't think age is of much concern, it's the events in his past. For instance, if your villian is a serial killer then he faced some form of trauma as a child. Neverthless, I think past events, especially during childhood, have a big impact on a person's personality. Not trying to sound like Freud but, childhood trauma is a big determinant of the person's personality. were his parents abusive or was he a loner as a child?

    I agree with Krisser, noone is completely evil. Does he have a personality disorder (ex: anti-social personality disorder makes a person want to hurt others and doesn't have any empathy, basically a person minus a conscience). I think it's always interesting when you can display an internal struggle between good and evil, it just makes things more interesting and gives depth to your villian. The fact that he is contemplating his decisions/attacks shows that he's still human and the reader will empathize with him. Everytime (almost) the evil side wins and the villian gets caught up in his acts until he's caught. . . then the guilt settles in. Usually. Or Maybe certain events forced him to walk over to the bad side. Ex: His family couldn't afford any food so, he was forced into the business of selling drugs or resorts to stealing. Morally, I don't think that's wrong because, it was his last resort to saving his family. Just things like that make the villian complex and so mcuh fun to write.

    I think I mentioned this before but, anti-social personality disorder seems to be common among many criminals. Maniac tends to be misleading because mania is a state of elation followed by depression, aka bipolar disorder, which isn't as common as ASPD. Men usually suffer from this and there is a strong link between childhood rejection and development of this disorder. Though these people seem very cutting and sarcastic, deep inside they crave affection and the need to feel accepted. I'm a psychology major. . .hope it wasn't too obvious ;)

    Ask your nameless character what he wants to be called. . . hah, what I meant is that there isn't a specific critera labelled 'names for villians' But what you do have to consider is his race and culture. Where is he from? Did he grow up in America? If so, which part? Here's a website with a ton of names, you'll definitely find something here:

    US Census Bureau. Click on dist.males.first.

    Good luck with your villian :)

     
  6. B-Gas

    B-Gas New Member

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    Okay, I've been reading this, and I think that one important point has been missed, both by the respondents so far and by many authors-

    The villain MUST be a hero in his own mind.

    End of story. If the villain isn't doing what he believes to be necessary, what he believes to be right, or what he believes to be virtuous, then he isn't believable. Every villain should be a hero in their own mind, and further, if the story was from their point of view, the protagonists would be irritating, perceptive, and continuous thorns in their side- villains.

    The only line separating heroes and villains is that villains start out with, and continue to have, more, stronger cards in their hand than the heroes. They also have fewer qualms, except in the more post-modern stories with antiheroes.

    As for the name issue, a villain's name must be distinctive enough that it can be recognized instantly, but common enough that the readers can accept it as part of your world- my villain's name is Christopher Coppen.
     
  7. Al B

    Al B New Member

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    One of the most important things is that the villain must seem capable of winning, and it's even better if it seems that there's no way the hero could possibly beat them. Of course, in most stories of that nature, we're pretty sure the hero is going to win, but the fun is in creating a situation whereby there seems no way the hero possibly could triumph, and so we keep reading to find out how the hell he or she is going to do it. This is helped by the hero having a flaw or weakness that the villain can exploit. Kidnap his girlfriend, expose him to kryptonite, threaten an entire planet's population, whatever.

    If all that is set up properly, it doesn't matter what the hell your villain is called, although there's no doubt that a good name helps. Some of that depends on how seriously you take yourself. In a tale of superheroes, it's fine to have a hero called Buck Dreadnought and a villain called Jet Fireball. But if you are writing something more grounded in reality, then you don't need to telegraph your intentions with a name, and you certainly don't want a bunch of dumb henchmen who just happen to be working for the bad guy for no clearly discernable reason.

    Al
     
  8. Aurora_Black

    Aurora_Black New Member

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    Well, I always liked the villains more than hero's in novels and even in my own stories. Sympathy was my approach for my villain, who is a blind 19 year old, and basically has accomplished more than anyone (which makes him both more formidable and threatening, even blind). So it kind of hurts the reader to see the MC kill a blind boy, maybe even cry (sort of the objective in my book :p). In all honesty the greatest villains are ones who are misunderstood, but narrow minded in thier purpose of evil-doing. like Captain Kurtz in Apocalypse Now.
     
  9. Lucy E.

    Lucy E. Active Member

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    ^ I must agree with you there, Aurora.
     
  10. edens garden

    edens garden New Member

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    I have a huge list of names written down, male female and surnames. Anything that caught my eye from a book, my own head, anything really. I sometimes find Baby name sites handy (i recommend babynames.com) because you can search in several ways. If there is a certain letter you want Marcus' last name to start with, search that way, you can also search by nationality, and my favorite, meaning. I have a lot of odd/unique names written down so feel free to PM me if you would like to hear a few.

    Hope this helped!
     
  11. Klee

    Klee New Member

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    I don't think a villain needs to be a loner or a maniac to be a villain. Many serial killers led pretty normal lives to the eyes of their family and friends until their crimes were discovered, take John Wayne Gacy for example. Of course, many, if not all of them had serious mental illnesses as well.
     
  12. Aurora_Black

    Aurora_Black New Member

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    Glad you do, on what points though? Do you like villains better then heroes? Or use a sympathetic approach?

    True, but then again for normal people leading an ordinary life, they were pretty messed up anyways. I mean have you ever seen the Ed Gein case? Ridiculous, I mean the occult probably isn't a scary aspect, but making a home of said body parts is.. unnerving.
     
  13. para_noir

    para_noir New Member

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    Okay guys, I've read through everything here and thank you for all the help!! :D. I've spent alot of time on him. So this is kinda a rough sketch I got till now.

    Name: Jason Mortensen
    Age: 26

    Okay he is a loner. He is very, VERY insecure. Has alot of self-esteem and rejection issues, which is the main reason why he avoids people. He has mental problems. Not the obvious and blatant ones. I mean the underlying ones.

    He had a very, VERY horrible childhood. His father was a drunk, and mom was a prostitute. The mother is killed by the father accidentally during a fight when he was drunk. Jason was 6 then. He walked into the parents room to find his mom dead on the bed and his dad cradling her in his lap crying.

    He also has this "rage" syndrome. He sometimes loses control. There is a scene I wrote where he kills someone when he gets one of these. Then he comes back to normal, and I describe him pushing himself into a corner of the room, shivering and crying at what he had done.

    This is my villain. What do you think???
     
  14. Vertz

    Vertz New Member

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    Pretty solid. His rough childhood would definitely add to any issues he already would have had otherwise. I'm wondering how exactly he is a villain. Is it that he just has deeper mental issues and kills people when he loses control, or is he trying to do something?

    Also, his last name is the same as one of my teachers last semester :p Awesome guy, so I had to ignore the name for personal reasons.
     
  15. para_noir

    para_noir New Member

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    He is trying to do something. :)
    Well more like, he is trying to prove something, which leads him to do alot of bad stuff.
     
  16. Vertz

    Vertz New Member

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    Fair enough :p Sounds good to me.
     
  17. Aurora_Black

    Aurora_Black New Member

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    Yep, seems like a good villain to me (although a bit of a loony :p), Jason is believable.
     
  18. Sam?

    Sam? New Member

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    There's no such thing as evil, only conflicting motivations. Hitler thought he was doing the right thing. So did the highjackers on 9/11.
    Some people may have mental issues that prevent them from feeling empathy. Others might actually enjoy hurting others, but the important thing to remember is, they've justified it to themselves. Maybe they believe in a dog eat dog world, survival of the fittest. Maybe they think they're above those they hurt.
    So work out who your villain is, why they do what they do, and how they justify it to themselves.
     
  19. vampire_dua

    vampire_dua New Member

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    1-Villains can be two years old if you want them to be. There is no age for the charachters. You create them and you make them how you want them to be.

    2- Being entirely evil is old fashion. So yes maybe you could try throwing there a motive of evil or a weakness point. It helps to make the antagonist appear real and more similar to humans.

    3-The personality depends on the plot. A loner, a murderer or a romantic savage lonely muderer. Whatever it is, it depends on how and where you want the novel to go. The plot helps you see it clearer.

    4-How about David Reynolds? Or Chris Taylor. Look up in children names websites and navigators. They help you to know how popular those names are and also their meanings.

    Hope I helped :D
     
  20. Cougar1002

    Cougar1002 New Member

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    Even villains need to have a motive beyond just "being evil." In their own minds, they think they're right--they usually don't see themselves as bad.

    I don't think age should be a factor, and sometimes the name of a character can work in your favor if you want to throw the reader off track.
     

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