When Is It Okay To Commit Suicide?

I have thought about suicide. I have wanted to commit suicide so I can understand why people would want to do it. And yes, it is a selfish thing. But why should it be about other people? Sure, it would cause pain for others but when you are in that state where you see no way out, no clear path ahead, then be selfish. I'm not for suicide but I understand why people do it. Could you be raped by hundreds of people and go about your life like Rebbecca from sunnybrook farm? Probably not.
And as for having terminal illness, then I agree. If you are in physical pain, then I believe that person should be free to make a choice to live or die. And anyway, forcing someone to live in physical pain is a form of torture, is it not?
And as for councillers, I'm sure they do a brilliant job but remember when teachers and such say that you can go to your doctor to talk about anything? I tried this because I didn't know how to contact a counciller and the doctor basically complained that I was takin up more time then what I had booked while I was sitting there bawling my eyes out. What an inconsiderate bastard. But I'm sure that there are good doctors to talk to. And friends. The problem with talking to your friends and family about your problems/depression is that after the third time, they don't seem to care as much and you probably have to pay them to listen intently. But hey, if you do suffer depression or such thing, try talking to someone, even if it's a counciller or doctor. Try and hold on.

Oh and I don't know any famous writer that has commited suicide.

(The above views are my opinion only.)

 

Couciller?

You mean counselor, no?

 

Slitting your wrists isn't as hard as you'd think, and it's not very effective - just dramatic. The real way to end it is to shoot yourself in the naggon. I'm not trying to give people advice here or anything - I'm just saying, it doesn't take as much guts as you'd think to pop a few pills and give up. It takes a lot more guts to be willing to live through your challenges, to face consequences, and to pull yourself through trials. There have been a few times in my life where I've contemplated suicide, I deal with depression at times as well..it's awful to try and find hope when your whole life seems dark -but I'm so glad I hold on, because I realize later on that those trials only made me a stronger and better person, they taught me compassion and understanding.

 

Yeah yeah, I know! I suck at spelling.

 

commiting suicide is ugly and selfish. I dont agree with it at all.

 

I just heard Anna Nicole Smith commited suicide. Good for her. That woman deserved to die.

 

I'm sure there are people more deserving.

 

What could be more selfish than insisting that people don't have a right to chose death if they so desire? Who has the right to force us to carry on living against our wishes?

In practice, of course, many of those who kill themselves are clinically depressed or otherwise mentally unbalanced, and not acting out of some perceived selfishness.

Cheers,
Rob

 

I still think its selfish and ugly. Depression doesnt take away your ability to reason. I think its sooo selfish because they only think about themsleves and obviously dont care about anybody but themselves. Now if they are mentally unbalanced it is a different story all together because they do not have the ability to reason. I am not saying that people dont have the right to kill themselves but how can you deny that they are selfish in doing so? I believe what they are doing is degrading themselves and saying im not worth living. What a ugly way to portray yourself.

Just my opinion though. I couldnt imagine having anyone I loved kill themselves and me be ok with it. I would be pissed off becasue they took a cowards way out.
no offense meant to anyone. Just being truthful in what I believe.

 

Trust me, people who commit suicide while suffering from clinical depression are not capable of the reasoning you and I can manage right now.

Cheers,
Rob

 

I am not so sure of that because there are many who try to commit suicide end up regretting it and trying to save themselves. I think there is reasoning behind that. Deciding to get help is reasoning. If someones is clinically depressed it doesnt mean that they are mentally unstable. However that is just a thought. No real facts behind it considering I have never been in that situation. So I cannot say from experience.

 

Well having spent so many moments where I just didn't feel like existing, I've thought about this a lot. Many people don't understand why anyone would want to commit suicide as they haven't. Well for me and anyone else who's experienced this, in depression you do lose your ability to reason. The fact is that you're beyond caring, every moment is suffering. You don't even think about missing you, and even if they do the strain of taking another breath of pain and torment is too much to bear. If someone gave you a reason to live, e.g. your kids or other responsibilities, you may continue to live and put on a happy smile, but this isn't enough to keep someone.

You feel lost, like the world belongs to everyone else and you're just a thorn in their side. You don't feel any love. Your mind tortures you constantly, you can't turn off that internal voice which belittles you, ridicules and doesn't stop feeding you negative thoughts. Beating you hour after hour, day after night, never leaving your side. You go mad, literally. It is at this stage where you lose the natural desire to want to live. You become hollow, a walking bag of flesh.

You don't even tell people your problems, not wanting to be known as the broken figure although it shows anyhow. Plus they wouldn't understand, nothing would make sense. You just have to find the answer yourself.
Ofcourse many suicidal people continue living, not because they want to, they just live because they were born, simple as that. The richness and fullness of life has left them. It is just seen as a trial.

People here have said its a cowards way out. Well, if living in pain of such magnitude that you are capable of understanding is brave, then call me a coward anytime.
You see at this point you don't even care what other people think of you, you won't be here to listen to their insults and judgements. You feel you shall be free.

I'd never kill myself, simply because I'm too much of a coward. Plus do you know how hard it is to kill yourself? Also i'm working through my problems, slowly. I don't really want to kill myself, i'm just not all that fussed about living. But honestly, judging or condemning doesn't help at all. The only cure is love and understanding. Thankyou for reading.

 

I am sorry that you are going through these types of problems E-bow. Hopefully you can work through them enough to the point where you feel happy again. I just think that life is a gift, and to throw it away is just awful. However, as much as you try to explain it to ..it just doesnt click in my head. It has never happened to me therefore like i said before i cant relate and tell it how it really is. Me saying it is the cowards way out... I guess is a little harsh-but its how i feel.I just think that some people feel to scared to deal with their emotions so they end it. I still think there is enough reasoning in people before they choose to end their life, but just choose not to use the reasoning. I guess what I am saying is that I cant comprehend it otherwise. I may be sooo incredibly wrong, and making a complete butt of myself...but i cant help but feel this way. Again. I really hope you are taking the steps necessary to better your life in a positive way. Good luck in your lifes journey.

 

Well what more can I say? The Encarta World English Dictionary defines the 'coward' as "somebody regarded as fearful and uncourageous". I guess then the people who continue living must be loving and courageous, because in
this world of polaritys you're either one or the other. And if you full of love then why do you hurt so much?

You see the point is people who contemplate suicide aren't too scared to confront their problems, they may not even know what their problem is. They might think that they are, as a person a problem. They don't believe in any solution, not for them anyway, which is why they choose to leave.

This isn't about morals or right or wrong, its just about serious pain which haunts you throughout your days, which you try to anyway you know how. Many 'normal' people experience this unconscious pain on a smaller scale. You don't believe me?

Why is it that men(yes I also mean female) insist on drinking, using any excuse possible? This lower your state of consciousness, why would any sane being do this? They are desperately trying to feel good, meaning that they are currently feeling bad, even with smiles on their faces before taking that first sip, there is an undercurrent of unease. It is the same reason why men sit on their couches mindlessly flicking through the channels for hours on end, not even concentrating on what they're watching. Prolonged hours infront of the set also lowers your state of consciousness. There are many other methods for lowering your consciousness, but the same principle applies. They are all trying to escape something, what is it? No, it is not life per se. But rather pain. Suffering.

Fraud even wrote a whole book based on the unnatural suffering which follows humans around unconsciously for most their lives. And they seem unaware. It has been going on for centuries, and is considered normal. Worse yet it is denied that it exists.

Now getting back on topic, anyone sane person who has experienced great suffering has contemplated suicide. When the undercurrent of pain becomes your prominant state, then it hurts, and makes you commit wild acts. It takes you over, and you literally do lose control of yourself and your emotions. Some women may understand this when they go through their menstral cycle. Have you ever read an article or seen an interview of a seemingly ordinary person who commits a hurrendous crime such as murdering his own family? Often he will tell you that he didn't know what came over him. No one in society accepts this. It feels like you're possessed by something, something evil. It can't be you, but you turn to the mirror, then gaze around the room and see you're the only person present.

It is also the fault of society, which makes the person believe that this pain is them. That the pain they suffer is themselves, and what person in their right mind can ever live peacefully knowing themselves as pain?

It is this, I believe which people try to escape. There is nothing else. Life can only be a gift if you allow it to be, yet some people are so over come by their emotions that they can't see straight. Like an anorexic girl who views herself in the mirror and see's something overweight. When I said they lose their ability to reason, I meant on the emotional scale, of course they can reason logically, yet it is not logical to live or die. It just is. Therefore you can't fight emotion with logic, its just not comprehendable.

They have already made the choice to end their lives way before they commit the act. Didn't you notice that hollow body stray past you? They act like they're already invisible, even in smiling. Yet because most people aren't emotionally aware, they fail to see past the outer shell.

It has even become a social stigma to openly speak of suicide, in a genuine concerning way. People are too ready to judge, and throw out words such as 'coward'. I am not writing this to get you to agree with suicide, I'm writing this so you can understand. I understand why some people rape and kill, it doesn't mean I agree with it. Yet with understanding comes love, and the true power to heal and make a lasting difference in someones life.

 

when nobody cares about you

 

You may understand e bow why people rape and murder but i dont. Maybe becasue they are sick. If you are saying that suicidal people are mentally sick like that then yes i agree-they do not have any reasonability to it. Suicide, i believe is a different matter though. You may be right in the fact that I am to judgemental about people who are suicidal. I just think the actions they take are ridiculous. you say that people have to allow life to be a gift. But i think the gift is just a given.maybe im just in some crazy happy bubble but i think that the gift should not be wasted and thrown away to soon. If the sufering is that bad then get help. They have that choice! but they choose to die. Ending evrything they ever had. I know you have taken offense to the whole coward thing since you have mentioned it everytime you reply and i am sorry you feel that way, but its just the way i view it. your definition told right. fearful of confronting their emotions, and uncourageous to live on and do something about their lives. I am not saying that people who do live are loving, but it does take courage to plow through the everyday. I also think it is logical to live or die. I get it. people feel suicide because of their emotions, i just dont understand how that emotion blinds them. I will never get how emotion blinds a murderer, or how the want of something makes you see things that arent true-yet it does happen. I think in some suicidal people that there is something mentally wrong with them. But i also think that there is some people who are just overdramamtic and too caught up in their own lives to look around at the positive side of things. now before you get bent out of shape over that I just want to remind you that i said "some people" I am not putting all suicidal people into two groups. Again... i hope tehre is no offense taken when you all read this. I am not meaning to hurt people in anyway, but how much of a "coward" would i be if i just conformed to what people wanted me to think? I would be a hypocrit. Thanks for reading

 

I didn't say I know why all murderers and rapists do what they do. There are endless reasons for people do or don't do things. All of that is irrelevant. Whatmatters is what you do. You see you look for reasons to feel good about life, I suppose there are many. Yet as many as there are good you shall find bad, and some people become trapped in the cycle of looking for the bad in everything that life presents.

Of course people who try to commit suicide are mentally sick, no more than the people who continue to live their lives suffering, or hoping for salvation in some distant future. Like I explained in my last post, which Freud wrote about, the majority of humans beings which are considered normal actually have a mental disease, suicide is simply one of the affects of this disease. Alchohol, drugs, tv, sometimes sex and other things are also the affects of this mental illness. But again what does this matter? You can study through the depths of the mind to understand insanity, yet understanding insanity does not bring about sanity.

You said the gift of life is a given. Well life is given, but you will only experience it as a gift if you allow it. Otherwise life will seem like a burden, like so many shiny happy people experience. Bills, relationship troubles, loss of any kind etc. Oh yes many people continue living, smile and tell you life is great, yet spend the majority of their time experiencing life as a burden. Then they will say you are wrong to opt out of the game, if they can put up with their PROBLEMS then why can't you?

For you see, as long as people have problems, they will continue to experience the majority of life as a burden, getting brief intervals of happiness. I have to tell you, you are in some 'crazy bubble'. Not in a harsh way, a bubble as in your vision is obscured. You are unaware of what is all around you. Don't you see those miserable people walking down the street? That agitated businessman, that stressed out mother. Can you hear that guy on the bus yelling down his problems on his phone? The truth is the majority of humans experience life as a burden, they may just be more prone to the happy scale of things. Others the sad scale. Whatever side you're on, you must alternate at some point, no matter for however long the cycle takes. Whether it be weeks, days or years of mostly happiness or sadness.

You say suicidal people are fearful of confronting their emotions, yet there emotions are fear! Fear/emotion same thing. This is what they are experiencing right now. It could be split into sub categories such as anger, regret, depression etc but they all fall under the same polarity in differing degrees. This is what is so difficult about confronting these emotions, which people don't understand, going through that brick wall of pain. Its not easy, and if you are to be successful you've got to keep your concentration in feeling the pain.

Its funny how you used the word 'plow'. As in struggling from day to day. It takes courage, almost as if you deserve a medal for taking on this beast of a thing we call life. But yet its all roses and sunflowers. Did you just reveal an unconscious belief in yourself? You answer that.

It is not logical to live or die. The desire to survive is natural, but it is not logical to live or die. Tell me the logic of dance? You live when you live, and die when you die, there is no logic or mind filtered equation behind this. Your body doesn't question its time, only the mind does. Ironically this powerful tool finds no answers, only more questions. It is so simple. You can't ask "how do I get to life"? Life is. You are life. Existence-Life, same thing. Your family, car and job are just things in your life, which is what you were referring to. Yet life is the box that holds these things in place. It is not logical or illogical to exist. You simply do. It can't be elaborated upon.

Would you say that a crazy person who jumped off a roof thinking he could fly had completely control over his actions? That he knew what he was doing and knew the consequences? Was it wrong of him to jump, knowing himself as super man? Knowing that he could fly was it illogical to get out that window? He was in no place to make a sound judgement or reason.

You can't understand how an emotion blinds a person using your mind. Emotion is the bodys reaction towards your mind. I know there have been times in your life when you've been blinded by emotion, its happened to us all, although at differing degrees. Yet maybe because you were so caught up in the emotion you didn't realise you were blinded, and there was no one to tell you this, so you treated that memory as if you had full control of your mind and body. If you can't understand this then it is true you have been blind for a very long time. This is called denial.

P.S. don't worry I'm not taking anything personally, I just like to state my points clearly and churn out any thought which I find relevant. And about the hypocrite thing, like I said before, If you re-read my previous post you'd see that I said understanding doesn't mean agreement.

~E-bow

 

suicide is nothing but a selfish, and gutless way out of life

 

Lol at above comment after all the discussion going on.

 

Lol at the above comment, just because.

 

<panto mode on>

Oh, no it isn't!

<panto mode off>

 

what i meant by plow is that sure there are burdens and obstacles in the everyday, but get over it.(easy for me to say i suppose) LEtting it build up on you is just going to mes up your chances of having a happier life.All of this just seems so simple for me, me saying i get why people find this so hard isnt going to happen. It seems like our convo is getting redundant-so many things we have said is jsut being repeated in different ways. I already told you my beliefs, they arent going to change no matter how we rephrase our replies. I know some people are mentally or emotionally messed up, but thats not everyone. Let me also rephrase the whole " i have never been blinded by emotion" statement...I have never been blinded by the kind of emotion that would ever lead me to taking my, or another humans life". I have never been suicidal or close to it. plus for me agreement does mean understanding. just goes hand in hand for me. I understand some of your points and agree with them, but overall my opinion still stay the same. I still think suicide is ugly....very ugly.....and unfortunatly all of this talk has not disuaded me from thinking its cowardly as well. I feel like our convo is not going anywhere, but it is interesting to discuss something so contravercial.

 

OK I won't go on. I just want to make the point once again which you overlook, this is not about changing your views, this was not my intention when I responded or ever will be. Your views will change of their own accord. It was about understanding. I didn't say it wasn't cowardly, I simply made the point that the world is full of cowards anyway, this is just the final cowards act. And phychologists who need to understand the minds of killers to solve a mystery, you wouldn't say they were in agreement with the mystery. And oh, some obstacles build up, and some just repeat themselves again and again in your life in different ways. Therefore you may end up piecing your life together and seeing it as one big obstacle.

OK I'll stop...unless you reply. Interesting conversation.

 

I think this convo was great. I like hearing other peoples views. I definetly agree with your coward theory now. We have finally narrowed it down to the liking of both parties haha. I remember you saying that you did not want to change my views, but I wanted to reinstate the fact that im not really changed even though you made some great points. I personally hope i never have to deal with somebodys suicide i know, because im not sure how forgiving I could be. I understand that they are fianlly done suffering like people say..... but I just hate how it would affect me. I guess that makes me selfish as well. hah. wow This is going in circles.
Good to learn new things baout yourself you didnt know eh

 

I'm suicidal. I took a drug overdose in July 2006. Spent 24 hours in the hospital.

It hard to explain to someone when you feel like there is no hope in the world.