I just shake my head when anybody starts talking about "correcting" other cultures. Talk about a sense of entitlement. Islamic terrorists want to destroy the infidels - why not, under the assumption that they have as much right to inflict their customs/religion/beliefs on us as we do on them? This is why wars start. One country or culture deciding it has a 'moral imperative' to dictate to another. Most countries have more than enough on their own plate, without worrying about someone else's.
Before mentioning the wrongs or rights of another you should take a walk in their shoes - at least that way you'll be far away and you'll have their shoes - Facebook 2012
As some may know, my wife is part Cherokee. I spoke to a guy last week while fishing on Lake Pyramid, An Indian reservation (Paiute Tribe). He reckons the Natives are a bunch of ungrateful this and that's. That if they want their land back they should shun everything whitie has done for them including bars and McDonalds - that they should live in wigwams and eat snake.
After living in France for five years I can tell you the French hate everyone - except the Germans - how ironic is that? Look up youtube for anti-Gay Pride Paris. Even the Maries of most towns or cities (the mayors) are turning in their badges to avoid marrying Gays or lesbians.
Do you really think in your heart of hearts that Western Superpowers are saving the Middle East from themselves?
Lol I was joking, when I saw the doc, I thought this woman's life has negative value, and the world would be better off w/o her
So it's not enough that their website is, "Godhatesfags"? Or that on their website they advocate for the "death penalty for fags"? Or that they use events to get media attention where people are grieving the loss of loved ones? Not sure what you are applauding. I don't think 'sticking to their guns' in their case is a virtue. If, on the other hand, you are just saying I might have said what I did with less outrage, you're probably right. But using the WBC as an example of someone saying: Saying one of the most ludicrously judgmental group of extremists is right because they said no one has a right to criticize another because everyone is a sinner was an outrageous thing to post. BTW, how is it I'm judging but you are not? I like you, so I hope you don't take that wrong. The point is, just about every comment in this thread is judgmental in some way. I used to have that 'to each his/her own' belief. I had to seriously question it when I saw that some of those cultures enslave women and children. Just because I'm not perfect is not a reason for me not to protest some of the worst human rights abuses in this world.
Oh, no, I agree. WBC is a terrible terrible thing and the people it has. However, I went to a few rallies and things of the sort for things I believe and support. No media coverage, nothing was ever done, a few essays and some outrage over news. It might as well have never happened as nothing real had been done. What I like about WBC is their tenacity and how they are very visibly trying to get their ideas across and how it actually reaches people. Of course, no one listens to them or even fathoms their ideas would ever take hold but I just feel if they had actually reasonable causes they'd a strong voice as they are out there and trying to make it happen. Point is: we all want change but not all of us do much about it. I was more focused on that part than anything throughout my rambling. I agreed that it was total poppycock to believe that or say it makes an ounce of sense. Oh, that last bit you wrote, not sure how exactly that came across. I never meant to say that I'm not judgmental (I am a VERY judgmental person in the worst ways) nor that you are and completely wrong to be so. I just meant that before we judge something, we should at least understand it instead of arbitrarily pointing fingers and crying "shame!". That part was not directed at anyone but more of a general observance you can sometimes see in others where they have developed opinions on a matter they know nothing about aside from not liking it.
Hell no. But many individuals think so, and governments are more than eager to use that as an excuse rather than admit greed. I find both arrogant.
Has tthis turned into a Westbro thread? If so I thought this was hilarious http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/19/westboro-equality-house-aaron-jackson-rainbow_n_2906337.html And I was feeling reallyleft out as an Irishman until http://www.irishcentral.com/news/God-hates-Ireland-claims-Kansas-Church-82241432.html @David Kulesh even a broken clock is right twice a day...
That's pretty harsh considering how much inequality gays have to face down there. I do think flag worshiping is an issue but damn >.> I just can't stop reading more articles about these people.
One of the worst problems with our society today, we worry too much about what other people are doing and not enough about doing the right things ourselves.
@erebh How did you know I am in love With Russell Brand?! *Struggles against hitting the pause and crying* Por Que, Ere? Por Que?! I have conflicting emotions of rage, bafflement, amusement, and sadness... "If God doesn't move you to do a thing, you don't do it." Well.. that's a troubling philosophy. But... if we do only what God says how do we ever do anything wrong... Hah! *Drools over Russell Brand*
However, bringing this back to the original topic, are the WBC violating anyone's basic human rights? I'd say no. Yes, they are vile and reprehensible, but mostly they just use their freedom of speech to try and further their cause. The original question would be, how would you treat someone if you knew they were part of WBC? Would you cuss them out? Punch them in the face? Be the bigger person and respect them, even though they don't respect others?
In Ireland or Britain that would be hate speech and they'd be arrested. Do you really think they should be respected? Who do they respect? I'd round them up and test out the oxygen levels on Saturn with them.
I can agree with this, though I really don't want to. I mean, the WBC holds protests at the funerals of soldiers with signs saying that the soldier deserved to die. They also stand on street corners chanting anti-gay slogans and holding anti-gay signs, which I find despicable. But I'm not quite sure this violates human rights. I would cuss them out for sure. The only reason I wouldn't punch them in the face is because I might go to jail. But if I could get away with it, I would do it for sure. I find it extremely hard to respect people like that.
I'd get their address and sign them up for a bunch of sexual device catalogs and free trial subscriptions to gay magazines. That way they have plenty of material to study.
Interesting responses. As much as it would be difficult, I think I would show them the love that they don't give. Maybe that's because I know someone much more powerful than me will eventually judge them for their actions.
I'd get that stupefied expression I get at times and just walk away. I don't have the energy or the will to deal with something that hurts my brain. There is a very thin line between free speech and hate crimes. Just like certain books, certain groups or rallies should be instantly disbanded under threat of persecution as their aim is to cause unrest or unease in a society. They aren't physically hurting anyone by chanting on street corners but it does make simple folk unhappy whether it's directed at them or not. Those kind of activities generate mob mentalities if they gather enough interest and lead to confrontations. Literally disturbing the peace. They have a right to whatever ideas, good or not, and to organize so long as there is no violence. The trick here is seeing whether their actions are as harmful to the country, not the people they affect, and if any violence can occur.
Not all speech is 'free speech.' The U.S. government has already defined certain circumstances where not all speech is protected by the First Amendment. Many of these instances is because the speech is considered 'incite-ful' and could cause harm to others. There are also several state and local laws that make it illegal to say certain things. I can remember a few years back a man in Michigan was arrested for yelling something vulgar when he fell out of a canoe. Here is an article about it: http://lubbockonline.com/stories/021800/nat_021800032.shtml
I don't support hate-speech or hate-crime legislation. It places certain groups on a higher position in the eyes of the law and also can be to easily abused by governments to silence free speech. I would support a law making it illegal to protest a funeral, for sure, because you are limiting a location, not the speech. But these whack jobs believe that God hates gays, but so far I haven't seen anything to suggest they advocate violence or vigilantism against gays. As you said, there's a line there, and I usually prefer to err on the side of freedom over government crackdown.
@A.M.P. Actually, you applied a reasonable approach to the WBC post. It looks to me like the person making the post said the WBC statement is what brought the issue to mind. But the idea of not being in a position to judge, for the reasons stated, is not an identifying characteristic of the WBC. It's a pretty standard Christian viewpoint, and a lot of people share it. So when reading that post you can either focus on the underlying substantive issue about whether we have the moral authority to judge, or you can have a knee-jerk reaction to the fact that WBC was even mentioned. GC's post was, at best, a failure to apply reason to the post and subsequent response, and at worst (and more likely) a run of the mill troll (as evidenced by the lack of substance, and merely resorting to snide or insulting comments). You don't have to backtrack for being a reasonable person.
If by failure to apply reason you mean I have an opinion that Fred Phelps has nothing of redeeming value to say about anything, I agree to disagree with you. But claiming that makes me a troll? Seriously? That's your position? Good grief!
