Wrote myself into a terrible corner, what now?

Discussion in 'Plot Development' started by Veltman, Feb 9, 2022.

  1. Joe_Hall

    Joe_Hall I drink Scotch and I write things

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    What if they both attempt to preserve their timelines, causing time itself to be blurred and the timelines collide with massive repercussions for both protagonist and antagonist? Maybe they loose their time-altering ability and the populace at large learns how the collision happened and hate them both? Just an idea if you are trying to have them both win without a total cop-out.

    As for having a "bad guy" win...it's been done. Brandon Sanderson wrote Mistborn where the dark lord wins. It then sets the stage for the rest of the series. I think it was one of my favorite of his books just because it was unique in that regard.
     
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  2. Seven Crowns

    Seven Crowns Moderator Staff Supporter Contributor Contest Winner 2022

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    Excellent!

    Time travel is a popular theme. That's good and bad. You have successful books that you can compare yours to when submitting. You also need to be able to tell your publisher what's different about your story. Something about it should be utterly unique. Then it's up to craft, voice, and the tension of story to get them through those initial chapters. I've heard it said that a publisher can tell if a work is unpublishable by page one (because of craft & voice). If you have those under control, they'll give those first chapters a chance and then it's all up to your story.

    You always have a chance. I mean, look at the disasters that make it into print, haha. But you're putting enough thought into your work that I think it bodes well.
     
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  3. SapereAude

    SapereAude Contributor Contributor

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    I LIKE IT!
     
  4. Kalisto

    Kalisto Senior Member

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    First off, don't be afraid to rewrite. Rewriting, even large sections of the book, is a natural part of the writing process. My novel from where I started to where I am now is so vastly different, that it really isn't even the same novel.

    And like you, I wrote myself into a hole.

    How do you get out? Well, I would say 99% of the time when I was stuck, it was because I didn't know what I was really trying to say. What point was I trying to make with any of this.
     
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  5. Alcove Audio

    Alcove Audio Contributor Contributor

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    Why not make them both antagonists? Not all stories have to be good guy vs. bad guy. How about the eastern campaign during WWII? You had Hitler and Stalin facing off, two of the worst mas-murderers in history. Maybe a third character who gets caught in the middle?

    In the classic Frank Capra film "Meet John Doe" no one is a good person at the beginning of the film; everyone is out for themselves, although several characters come around as the film progresses. Maybe your protag starts as a bad guy and has the "what am I doing!" moment that changes him.
     
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  6. VicesAndSpices

    VicesAndSpices Member Contest Winner 2022

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    These are REALLY GOOD. They break down the potential endings into the two most important parts: how the conflict is resolved and how the MC is changed. I know you already made your decision on the ending (and I fully support the choice you made), but I want to emphasize that in the resolution, you need to drive home the character development. It shouldn't just be a story for the sake of the story, but there should be some sort of emotional resolution within the MC that will make your audience think about whether your character is sympathetic and someone they want to reflect in their own lives.

    I can say for sure that even if a publishing house won't read it, my dad will. So do with that what you will.
     
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  7. stryga

    stryga New Member

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    Reading this thread I start to wonder how your MC can restore the world to a prior outcome anyway. I mean technically. The world is a terrific complicated gadget. If your MC goes back in time and tries to do exactly the same as last time - even then the world would evolve as a different one. In the Hitchhikers Guide the "Plural Sector-caveat" introduce a similar plot device - there it is more about multiverse but it also turns out that it is actually impossible to re-enter exactly one timeline. I would expect a similar effect in your single timeline universe in the sense that you always create a "new" timeline when you jump back, no matter what you do.
     
  8. Annette

    Annette Member

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    I think the novel sounds great. As a fan of stories that surprise me, I love when the main characters fool me into being someone I didn't expect. I will rewatch movies to see where I missed clues about who this person really is. Most recently Lars Von Trier's Nymphomaniac on Netflix. Not that this story compares at all but without there being a spoiler alert things aren't as they seem. Shouldn't be surprising with Lars. I get that you want the ending to be a satisfying one but I will remember and be haunted for years when a story ending shocks me.

    I say meditate for a few days without expectation (you might already do that). It's possible an idea will come that had been subconsciously lurking there leading you to where you are now in the story!

    That being said, I like ending 2 but I think I would prefer ending 3. I also really like the idea of the protagonist and antagonist being called to work together in some capacity. Unless the antagonist is a complete sociopath it can be nice to see a multi-dimensional character.

    I would love to read this.
     
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  9. Mckk

    Mckk Member Supporter Contributor

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    This reminds me of Steins:Gate, a time-traveling anime. In order to save a friend, the MC must undo all the histories he's changed (that he did originally to help other friends).

    The question isn't which ending you prefer, or even what should your MC do. The question is for you, the author: What is your MC's character arc?

    What was his journey? What was the thing he had to learn? What was the flaw he once believed in, and now - if you want a happy ending, then a flaw he has learnt to overcome? And if you want a tragedy, then a flaw he doubles down on and suffers the full consequences of? Who is your MC? I don't mean his name - I mean, what is he made of?

    That is your ending.
     
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  10. SilverWolf0101

    SilverWolf0101 Active Member

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    I just have to say I love stories that make me question some part of my humanity. I want that punch in the gut surprise ending, the one that makes me sit up in shock and go back and reread the last paragraph or page to make sure I hadn't misread the thing I just read.
    That said, each ending is interesting in their own rights. Though personally, I feel as is the black vs white/good vs evil decision in books is overused too often as a cop out. I know you said you were worried about a cop-out, and there is quite honestly, a lot of ways a reader can interpret which way was a cop-out. The market is overly saturated with the good guy always wins, gets everything he wants, and everything is all perfect and they're portrayed as the righteous hero. Give readers something different. I know the people you shared your story with felt uncomfortable by one ending or another and therefore did not care for it, but that doesn't mean everyone will. I would honestly find a larger group of people to review the material to get a complete deal on how the ending should go. This is something publishers will also consider, there's constant studies to see how the market will respond to certain material by sharing it with a large group of individuals.
    I like the moral grey area of your story. I love that you make us question who is correct in their actions. Who truly is the bad guy, and who honestly is the good guy in this situation? Who truly wins in this situation? It's not an ending you see very often, especially in books.
    There is one other possibility you can consider, though it may to feel like a sort of cop-out to certain readers. Give an ending where we, as readers, don't truly know who wins. Leave it a mystery. Now I'm not saying you just cut off the book at the worst possible moment. Where, say there's an explosion and bam! There's nothing after that explosion. The book just ends.
    Instead, just go to the mystery. Kind of like the book, The Giver by Lois Lowry. Many readers questioned what the true ending was. I won't spoil it in case you haven't read it personally, but that question lingers. So maybe try the same thing with your book?
    Take the small paragraph;
    "And so, they (protagonist/antagonist leave it vague unless they're both of the same sex) walked through the (describe a scene that could suit both timelines, something that wouldn't give the obvious answer to who wins). Their eyes tracing over the familiarity of their world. Faces they knew, histories that they had been a part of things that hadn't been there before all this began. It had been worth it. Everything they had done, everything they had sacrificed along the way, it was all worth it in the end. At least now, they could rest easy."
    We don't know who won, we don't know who got their happy ending. It's a question that will linger in the air and make us go back into the book, trying to figure it out but never truly having the answer. We'll want to talk about it, we'll want to ask people if they've read the book. It may leave some people uncomfortable, but I find it's best not to dwell too much on "who is going to hate my book because of this?" Every book faces that problem, no matter what the subject is. Take things like the Twilight Series: I hate it, my sister loved it. Or a collection of poems from Edgar Allen Poe: I enjoy them, my sister thinks it's boring. And things of such.
    All I can say is write the ending you feel completes the book. Not the characters, the book itself. What would bring closure to these characters and this world? Unless you plan on turning this story into a series, or the possibility of a series, then your book should have closer by the last page.
     
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  11. SapereAude

    SapereAude Contributor Contributor

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    There is a difference between "erasing" someone who exists, and reverting to a reality in which those people never existed. If they never existed, how can they be erased/killed?

    That (IMHO) might be the best way to explore the paradoxes presented by mucking about with history and timelines. Once you accept the possibility of multiple, parallel timelines, where do you stop? I have thought about this. My view is that if this possibility is to have any validity whatsoever, the number of parallel, co-existing timelines must be infinite. Why? Because every time ONE person makes a decision, another alternate timeline is created.

    I had my first serious girlfriend when I was a sophomore in college. She was still in high school When she went off to college, she decided that we should not consider ourselves committed to one another. We never got back together, and she later married someone else. Is there a parallel timeline in which we didn't break up, but stayed together and married? Is there yet another timeline, one in which we broke up but later got together again? If we got together again, did we marry, or did we ultimately break up again? Did we have children? If we married, did we stay together, or did we divorce? Did I become an architect, or did I become a lawyer -- or did I become something else?

    And this is just a few of the possible alternate histories of two people. Now layer on just the permutations and combinations offered by the fact that she had a brother and I have a brother and a sister. For each and every alternate choice my GF and I made, our potential lives could (and probably would) have been affected in different ways by the similar decisions of each of our siblings. Now multiply that by the population of the world, and the concept is staggering.
     
  12. Aly M

    Aly M New Member

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    Like you said earlier, it kind of makes the protagonist a villain. I really enjoy books where the protagonist turns out to be a villain and/or has moral ambiguity; it makes everything less predictable. We are all villains in someone's story. Just wanted to say I love your ideas!
     
  13. Charles Neal

    Charles Neal Banned

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    The best way to get out of a time travel bind is the multiple timelines theory. Just send everybody back to the "timeline" they're supposed to be in. (Yes I used to want to work for Marvel, why do you ask?)
     
  14. Catrin Lewis

    Catrin Lewis Contributor Contributor Contest Winner 2023 Community Volunteer

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    And maybe the protag has to accept that the "villain" is only that in his (the protag's) eyes, that maybe the reversal happened for his own good, and he needs to accept that he shouldn't have been mucking around with the past in the first place?
     
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  15. Lili.A.Pemberton

    Lili.A.Pemberton Active Member

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    Exactly :). It's a little cliche, I suppose, but, I mean, you mess around with time and you're bound to run into some consequences.
     
  16. Damage718

    Damage718 Senior Member

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    This kind of reminds me of a friend's project in which he's been toying with multiple endings for years. I suggested the "Waynes World" ending to him, which may also help you.

    What if the antagonist had the power to show the protagonist what could/will happen? Like a threat...where if he meets whatever his goal is, then this would be the result. You can fit one ending scenario in that scene.

    Then back to the characters' reality, the protagonist figures out how to save the day, and the real ending happens.

    Just a high-level thought, and could be a way to incorporate multiple endings in the same story.
     

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