If it helps (or maybe only makes it more confusing), I'm 23 and I find those threads just as confounding. I definitely craved feedback when I was younger - who am I kidding, I still do - but it would never have occurred to me to ask people what I should write, when it comes to characters or tone or whatever. You'll see me in a lot of those threads urging the OP to write what they want to write. And you'll see me on other platforms ranting to my friends about people who apparently want others to write their story for them. But as other people have brought up, generalizing an entire generation off just a few data points is a bit silly. PBS Idea Channel has a pretty interesting video about millennials and generations at large, but the relevant bit starts at around 3:40 - talking about 'actual generations' and 'generation units'. ETA: Wait, no, it would occur to me to ask someone else what I should write! I've done that exact thing - when I was explicitly writing something for that person
Tell me of a typical mellennial that does not have the latest iphone, and I will be impressed. My generation sucks on multiple accounts. Bunch of simpletons of shallowness they are. So I am denying and denouncing the generation that I have somehow been lumped into. There are few and far between that don't fall into the lame demographic that defines them. Only a bunch of twits would be obsessed with iphones and calling themselves Hipsters. I hate know that I liked things before they were cool, while simultaneously not being apart of that crowd. How embarrassing it is.
Like I said, I go to school with a number of Millennials and not one that I know has the latest iPhone.
Interesting you have noticed such a manifestation of character, because it's my recent focus of research. (Writing a story that corresponds to this matter, somewhat indirectly though). What set me off to this research was the Korean educational system. I don't think that it has to do with all "millennials" but at least with specific groups of some. For example, in Korea recent studies have shown that although most of their citizens are overqualified for their positions (it's a rat race getting a job in Samsung or LG), but they lack in the creative sense of artistry. In designing parts of the process, (for example, designing not only an air dynamic car, but also pleasing to the eye), they tend to hire people from other countries. I think that this outcome is a result of focusing their studies in specific areas and learning methods, due to fear of not achieving a desirable position that is directed towards a trade with limited perspectives. The students try to be the best of the best and the educational system is very strict and conservative. But think about it. It's not such a mystery if you have noticed such a difference. Today's children and adolescents are daily bombarded with a whole lot information (much more than your generation ever was) and a much vast universe of possible choices are opened in front of them. They are told that in order to make it into this expanding economy that favors the few, they have to be the best of the best. They always have to compare themselves to everybody before and ahead of them. Everything is already filed and up for examination. It is very unnerving. Having more choices can be a good thing as it can be a bad thing too. It is confusing and makes you feel that you are risking your life upon engaging to a specific cause. Are you going to be the thriving winner or the sore loser? The middle ground is gone. All these varieties of tutorials, the already close to perfection arts and tools, all these "how to be the perfect human" manuals and the fast paced society that doesn't excuse a skip beat, have left a big portion of youth somewhat scared shitless and I guess they need some time in order to figure out how to find themselves. In such an unstable and unpredictable environment, it is only natural to focus on stability. How can you express anything when you are drowning in indecision? You learn that you have to "please" first, at least that's the distinct message that I'm getting out of these times. So, so many paths and guidelines! When I enrolled into a graphic design school, I was pretty much sure about my skills. Very fast learner, very inspired and very focused. I made a difference in class. Second year and I felt utterly defeated. So many mediums to use that had to do nothing whatsoever with creativity itself. It had to do with learning, but not creating. It put my creativity into a very narrow frame. My mistakes were rubbed in my face and a whole lot of extraordinary artists seemed simply unreachable, as I tried to implement my newly attained knowledge that was supposed to be helping me. Instead, I became obsessed with it, I got very tired of all the rules that applied, since now I had to always observe them consciously in every part of the way and when I felt utterly defeated, I simply couldn't visualize any picture of my own to express on paper. All these comparisons from my teachers and all those guidelines made my head spin. It was as if they wanted to reprogram me. Well... they failed. Everything that has been dismantled in front of my eyes gained immeasurable weight. My passion was gone and my inspiration just flew out the window, as I felt that I didn't fit the glove. Entering the market only lasted about a year or two, before I quit once and for all. It was a rat race. Nothing to do with creativity, I promise. The job was straight-forward: "We want this. Follow the guidelines." I kid you not that I suddenly became allergic to pencil! I would get blisters while sketching.
I'm a Millennial and I don't have the latest iPhone. My husband does but only because his phone broke and he needed a new one. And he's definitely not obsessed with it. Only really uses it for work emails.
I'm the same way. I'm also a Millennial and the only reason I have a newer one is because I jumped into a pool last summer with my phone in my pocket my old one broke.
Seriously, there is something extremely simple about people making this about iPhones or their about their mobile phones in general. Or about Hipsters or whatever buzz word people come up with. Anyways, this thread is getting into silliness to me. I'll leave you all to it. *eye roll*
I only even got a smartphone about three months ago, and the one I've got isn't top of the line or an Apple product - though I realize that for some people 'smartphone' and 'iphone' are apparently interchangeable. Don't get me wrong, I love it (I unlock it with my fingerprint, how fucking sci-fi is that?), but if I had to go back to a flip phone it wouldn't be the end of the world. Off the top of my head, I can't think of any of my friends who have the newest version of whatever kind of phone they may have, and most of them don't have iphones. So, y'know, again: 'denouncing' an entire generation based off of a few data points - pretty silly. And most of the technologically-based criticisms leveled at millennials that I hear aren't, in my experience, actually valid? When I spend time with my friends we're very rarely 'glued to our phones' and if we do look at them, it's most likely to check a text real quick (eg: I have ailing grandparents who I help take care of, one of my friends has a toddler, one is on call most of the time, so we have to stay alert) or google something pertinent to the conversation. My mom is on her phone as much as I am, if not more. Last night she and I were at her musician cousin's jam session and instead of being present in the moment and paying attention, she had the gall to be scrolling through facebook! Also, she kept tapping my leg to show me stuff she thought I'd like, which was very sweet and nice. Meanwhile my millennial ass was playing pokemon go. Which she plays with me. Oh us shallow kids and our iphones.
This is very Millennial behavior...vehemently against generalizations, offended by outrageous statements. I also think Millennials lack a sense of humor.
The funny thing is, it appears that generalising about generations is fairly ingrained in our thinking. This thread got me to go to Wikipedia, to do some more reading on the subject. I found not only a long article about Millennials, but also one for Generation X, complete with references, etc ...and a breakdown of what the article sees as 'characteristics' of that generation. I though both articles were quite well presented, and pretty much fair. I think maybe it's got less to do with individual people, and more to do with the influence of the environment within certain 20-year periods. While it's silly to say all people within a period will be the same, it's also not quite right to say that the environment they grew up in won't have some effect on them. A generation that grew up in widespread poverty will have different values and different expectations from one that grew up with everything they needed easily available. A good example is the make-do-and-mend attitude of my parents' generation, who grew up during the Great Depression and then WW2, whereas the generations that followed, mine included, are more likely to throw 'old' stuff away—even before its usefulness is gone—and buy replacements. We are more likely to be influenced by 'new and shiny' in a sales pitch, while my parents wanted to know 'will it last?' Of course the edges get blurred, and individuals react differently to the same set of circumstances. I think it's more interesting (and it is interesting) to look at what influenced these different generational splits.
That's actually true. My 70-year-old husband said old guys down at the pub go around sharing 'jokes' on their phones, rather than telling jokes out loud. It drives him nuts! They're always shoving the phones under his nose, going 'look at this one.' He refuses to look. He feels the art of speaking is beginning to vanish, and he doesn't want to be part of it. However, you're right. It crosses generations. There are still generations out there who remember what it was like before phones took over our lives. I wonder what it's like to be a younger person who can't remember that far back. Studies have been done that some people actually suffer anxiety attacks if they become separated from their phone. I don't mean they lost the phone, but forgot to take it with them, or whatever. My niece is a 32-year-old millennial, and so is her husband. On a recent visit to us, their phones were NEVER ...and I mean never ...out of their hands. They are courteous people, and didn't look at them constantly or flip through them during a conversation, but they never put them down, either. Any time an answer to something was required ...bingo, the phone would provide the answer. I was similtaneously impressed and bothered. Especially when I discovered that they had no other backup, and if something had happened to their phones they would have been badly stuck. Their plane tickets were on the phones, their itinerary was on the phones—including hotel addresses and numbers—phone contact numbers for friends and family, etc. I asked my niece "What if you lost your phone or it stopped working?" and she said "I'd be really really screwed, but my husband still has his, so we'd be okay." Erm....
What an insightful paragraph that is. I think you are probably totally right. Maybe this matters slightly less to people in various other countries, but yes. I think that's a totally believable take on this issue. The fact that we are now bombarded by 'too much' information is something I feel myself. I remember back when that was not the case at all. You got your daily dose of information from a newspaper or the TV or the radio. Period. If you were really REALLY interested, you bought a couple of different papers, although they tended to cover the same stories as each other, only with slightly different slants. If you wanted specialist information, you went to a library. Now? I challenge anybody to think up ANY topic and put it into a search engine and come up with nothing. It truly seems that everything you could ever want to know is now available with a click and a few keyboard strokes. And yet, are we better informed? One look at the outcome of the recent US election, and what fuelled the result? I'd say no. We're just jaded, and getting to the point where we can't distinguish what is real and what isn't. Or which worthy cause we should latch on to. I feel the burden of information overload, and look at my changing habits as a result. There was a day when I didn't wake up in the morning and immediately start interacting with people I've never met from across the world, for example. I do that now. Cup of coffee to the right of me.
http://www.onin.com/fp/fphistory.html It is relatively old tech, fingerprint tech is. Also we have become too dependent on technology. I can still remember when cell phones were not all that common. Granted they were also really expensive. Also I don't identify with my 'generation' in many ways. But who cares. For better or worse I was raised in a very hostile and violent house, so unkind words and shaming are pretty much my bread and butter. But with all bouquet of drugs available on prescription demand who has to feel bad about anything? Guess I got the wrong end because I self medicate (dear old dad you taught me well, I can handle my liquor). Though as an adult being a bitter bitch is only too easy, when you fall into the default position of not fitting in for no other reason than you can't have a society without outcasts to look down on. Hooray for society, you made me what I am! Are you proud? So take your meds and be happy you aren't ever going to know what it feels like to be left behind, because your little cliques can't handle reality. And again this is to the majority in my 'peer group'. (From the tiny place you run and hide from in your drug induced denial.) So kindly tell me about how great our generation is again...
Awww. Those things you mention do cross generations, unfortunately. I'm sorry you've had a hard time. Hostile house, violence, unkindness. Not good. The 'expensiveness' of this technology that you mentioned is an issue, though. What happens to people who can't afford a SmartPhone (or the tariff they need to pay in order to use it?) That's another issue that really bothers me about technology's grip on us. It costs a lot of money to keep up ...and some folks just don't have that money to hand. Well, they can go to the library and go online there? Right. Except libraries are closing down and/or shortening their hours. Internet cafes have pretty much vanished because 'everybody' has their own device. Payphones? Hardly any. Not a good situation.
Kinda funny how we have turned into a Robin Williams joke when it comes to technology. As for the rest of what I said. It sucks when you don't belong, and people are jerks.
I don't understand something. How can there be nothing worth mentioning about how a post-9/11 world has affected this generation? Or how 'smart'-phones have affected the way people think ("people" referring to those who have grown up with them since birth)? Or how bully-liberalism and the PC culture has spread victim mentality? I understand that older generations who have not grown up with these things, can still be affected by them. But it's quite a more-than-safe assumption that a developing brain will be far more affected on average than a developed one. I think there would be a lot to learn from studying these affects and making comparisons between - for example - those who only know a world run by the internet, versus those who clearly remember a world from a long, long ago in a galaxy far, far away. So of course you can't make a broad statement about how "generation x, y, or z are less creative because reasons". As mentioned by others, there are a large amount of other factors at play here as well (race, gender, social class, etc). But unless I've simply had a misunderstanding, it seems to me that there's an elephant in the room and somebody's tried to sweep it under the rug.
I think you're kind of hitting the right nail. But it's more than developing/undeveloped brain that factors in. It's that older people remember—personally remember—when certain things weren't the norm. Before certain things happened. It's called experience, and it can work for and against a person. However, unless you get a brain injury, it's likely to affect you one way or another. That might make you get set in whatever ways you feel are best, or it might open you up to new possibilities. That reaction is down to the individual, and what kinds of things you do with your life. Over the past few years, I think I've crossed the threshold between openmindedness to 'I'm too old for this shit.' Reinventing the wheel every time something new comes along—just so I can continue to do what I did before—gets VERY old. Especially if the 'new' is a lot more complicated without giving back much in the way of improvement. I suspect this stage is going to get reached by a lot more people a lot sooner, as technology whirls along, spinning us oldies off into the ditch enroute. My aforesaid niece, who has been raised with computers and is glued to her iPhone 24/7, is already getting annoyed every time there's an upgrade to her phone/computer operating system, and she has to change the way she accesses her information, and hunt for where her stuff has been hidden this time. She said "I just want to get on with my work. I can't be bothered trying to find out what they've done THIS time." She fell off the bus when Apple changed from iPhoto to Photos, and all of her photo categories vanished. She's got thousands of now-unsorted photos, and has never gone back to sort them into new categories. She doesn't have the time. This kind of thing eventually wears you down. Yes, even young folks who are on top of the game at the moment. Trust me. You'll remember I said this.
@jannert I think that what @Foxxx meant is that it's different growing up in this environment as a child or a teenager or even as an adolescent, as your personality is still developing and you are not fixed upon any conclusions yet, since everything is still getting collected and processed simultaneously at this stage, than being already over that stage, having attained a more complete sense of direction and personality. At least that's what I'm getting.
Yes, I get that. But Foxx was making the point that a lot of it is physical...how the brain is developing, etc. I think there's more to it. It's not just that older people have more physically developed brains, it's that they also remember other times. I suspect if you could put a 20-year-old and a 50-year old in a state where they remember nothing, then start their memories from scratch, they would both react to their present environment in similar ways.
You are correct @Malisky. I agree @jannert that there is more to it than just the physical development. I was more referring to both the physical and mental sides of it. I'm no expert in social sciences, but I'm just saying that the creativity - or other characteristics - of a generation can certainly be influenced for better or for worse by the environment. To figure out if the overall influence has been a good or bad one, you'd need to actually design a study and do some scientific research / experimenting. It would probably need to cover all the bases as far as gender, race, and financial well-being, across all areas of the country. With a large sample size like that, over a period of years you could define a trend. Which you could then compare with the generations of before and after, if such a study were also conducted on them. There's *a lot* more to it than that. But in other words, it'd be an immensely challenging study to undertake, with plenty of room for error. Assuming you could get past the initial roadblock of figuring out how to "measure" creativity.
I'm not sure if I got this right, but I don't think so. There are physical differences between a twenty year old brain and a fifty year old one. I'm not saying that a fifty year old brain is expired, but a twenty year old brain is much more capable of absorbing new data and more efficient in processing it. Nerve connections are made much easier and faster, even if muscle memory might be under developed in comparison to a well bred fifty year old brain. Muscle memory is a different function all together than processing new data, then making it into muscle memory. It has to do with nerve connections building paths, blood flow and oxygen flow. It's somewhat biological. At least that's what I think. Not sure. Has been a while since I was interested in the brain functions and its biology. My muscle memory upon such stuff sucks. Barely breathes nowadays.
One of the things I noticed while reading the articles on Wikipedia regarding Millenials and Generation X is that they do allow for the differences between gender, race, and financial status, and they do admit that some of these things mean that people will not necessarily represent the average from that generation. Of course these things factor in. That's why it doesn't make sense to label everybody with the same characteristics, just because they were born within a 20-year period. I guess the thing to do is study what these people have in common (if it's possible) that sets them apart from other generations with similar gender, racial and financial circumstances. I suspect you'd find, for instance, that women born in the 1920s have a much different slant on 'being a woman,' to women born in the 1980s. It's all about the environment they were raised in, and the expectations placed upon them. One thing was particularly interesting for me to learn about Generation X (the generation after mine, the Baby Boomers.) Because their future was less assured than ours had been (or seemed less assured, for various economic reasons) many of Generation X became entrepreneurs, rather than working for somebody else. Getting a university degree, for Generation X, was no guarantee of a job. Neither was expecting a job for life. So they had to make their own success, either by starting up their own businesses, or developing much more job flexibility than we did. They also tend to work harder than we did, and be more ambitious. They also tend to just get on with it, without fanfare. I had to smile, when the article said "If baby boomers succeed at something, they tend to run around crowing 'see what I did, see what I can do.'" Generation X just does it, and moves on. Generation X is more stoic than the Baby Boomers were, and take far less for granted. I think there's something true in that outlook. As a Baby Boomer (the middle group—post Elvis, Woodstock-era) I always assumed that generations following us would be even less conservative (politically and socially) than we were. How surprised I was to discover it doesn't work like that. Women I knew as friends worked really really hard to get rid of compulsory makeup and high heels, for example. We loved dressing casually, and making our own style, and giving the proverbial two finger salute to the fashion industry and 'uniforms' for women. We liked being pretty, but on our own terms. Imagine our discomfort when our daughters and granddaughters adopted makeup and high heels, and followed the dictates of fashion much more enthusiastically than we did—and were pretty comfortable in uniforms. This was not what we expected at all! Being the "That's cool, whatever" generation, we more or less accepted it, but I don't think we ever understood it.
It would have to do with the female brain's developing and adapting relative to the changes in society. But yes, like you said, there are numerous other factors involved that would prevent you from making defensible accusations about an entire generation that spans the whole globe. That's why I proposed the better way to go about it, is to study how technology has affected two (or more) different groups. One way to define these groups, could be "Group A, who have lived and breathed smart phones since they came out of the womb and took a selfie with their mother" to "Group B, who lived half their life in both eras" and so forth.
